Planning to Buy ‘Tribes of the East?’

[King Imp]

Which one of these lovely descriptions is the one they were going for?

I believe Pol's link says it all.

I like the Urban Dictionary descriptions better.

[okrane]

TT's weird :p

[Orfinn]

TT's weird :p

Shhhh...! Watch it or he may turn you to a zombie with a chainsaw attached to your head and a taste for pina colada.

Though... nothings like cyanetic powa....

[ThunderTitan]

TT's weird

You're all just ignorant.

The cover art, which features an actual chocolate starfish amidst a field of hot dogs, is perhaps an allusion to anal sex.

[Zamolxis]

Which one of these lovely descriptions is the one they were going for?

I believe Pol's link says it all.

I like the Urban Dictionary descriptions better.

And I think that's the correct one anyway. The story with the can of egg stuff and the rest sounds so made up, that they probably came up with only afterwards to avoid making the album title sound too gross. It was already quite criticized, so probably they were just trying to avoid a banning.

Boy are we on topic.

[ThunderTitan]

The wiki article says what the title implies... (they cover it up by referring to the cover and sh1t)!

[Wolfsburg]

That discussion is heading nowhere. Exactly like the pseudo-messias who preach that the anime-like angels from HOMM5 are ugly and that the djinns should be called genies, and should look like genies and... that the game from Ubisoft is a shame.

Its quite interesting how they try all their best to make the game look ugly and the expansion look uninteresting.

But the poll results talk for themselves.

If AI will be upgraded in TotE, better. If not, I will still have enourmous fun with my hot-seat duel partners. And there is no way your despite for the Djinns appearance is going to change that.

Now back to the fertile discussions!

I think the Rakshasa Rani should be called Nala and the Raja should be called Simba... and where is Sandro?!

UBISOFT, YOU KILLED SANDRO! YOU BASTARDS!!!

[MistWeaver]

Exactly like the pseudo-messias who preach that the anime-like angels from HOMM5 are ugly

Buy yourself an explanatory dictionary and save us from your further ravings

[Wolfsburg]

Why are you even discussing? You are right man. You should just ignore me and tell the others how is HOMM5 condemned to failure...

What was that with the frying pan gargoyle again?

[Wolfsburg]

I was perhaps unsucessful trying to say why I think your critics are not valid. Ill give it one more shot. And then I´ll spare you of my further ravings.

Your critics are based on personal tastes. Ugly angels? I dislike the color pallete and enviroment?

I for example find Picasso extreme boring. I dislike his lines and find his work bland. Except fo sorme pieces of the blue phase, in wich he is sucessful to please my taste. BUT, nevertheless, Picasso is Picasso, the man is an icon that is established and its praised by the majority of people. The fact is: I do have enough perception not to go around trying to convince people that the work of Picasso is ugly. Because that is a waste of both our times.

If you get it now, this means that arguing about the names or appearences of the creatures is simply a dead-end way. You can convince me for instance that the new iniciative bar made the combats more dynamic. But, you most surely cannot convince me that the angels would look better without a cape, or with longer hair, or whatever.

Because, finding something beautiful or ugly is not a racional parameter and cannot be measured or compaired.

[ThunderTitan]

Please, in 5 years time most people will look at H5 and agree that it looks bad... just like most 3D games that get old and have mediocre art and no aesthetic completion.


But you're right, it's pointless to try to convince people not to just accept being fed trite crap when they find reading a huge chore and spend every year more money on the same game with slightly better graphics (sports games) and different button schemes.
But as we don't have a good game to play complaining is all we got...

[MistWeaver]

You should just ignore me and tell the others how is HOMM5 condemned to failure...

Forget about dictionary, it looks you cant read anyway.
I never said (or had in mind) that HOMM5 condemned to failure. Because I know that it was successful. About 700.000 sales world-wide (without HoF) to be precisely. But still - its worst game in HoMM series for me.

Your critics are based on personal tastes.

So.. some ppl like bugs and dead AI after all..
(and this .. http://resources.ubi.com/resources/65/6 ... cement.jpg)

I for example find Picasso extreme boring.

Like I said, there are criterias that define work of art from ameteur slapdash.

Because, finding something beautiful or ugly is not a racional parameter and cannot be measured or compaired.

Yeah, and arts critics still get money for their job, how odd..

What was that with the flying pan gargoyle again?

Its ugly. Even most obstinate fanboys agree on that.

[Wolfsburg]

I never said (or had in mind) that HOMM5 condemned to failure.

... this game resembles Frankenstein's creature. Composed of diffrent, frightful parts, stitched with white threads. Wrong move - and it will fall apart.

Perhaps that way to express yourself was just an extra spice on your anti-HOMM5 retoric, but this whole fall apart thing sounded to me like someone who really thinks that HOMM5 is in the same fragile bankrupcy situation as HOMM4.

If that was not the case, punkt schluss.

Like I said, there are criterias that define work of art from ameteur slapdash.

No there aren´t. There are just people with influence enough to make you believe that they know whats beautiful and whats not. Thats the work of art critics, they are not so different from speculators. They`re job is to make you like something that you originally wouldnt, so they can earn money on you and make you buy fony posters of Botero to hang on your living room.

Its ugly. Even most obstinate fanboys agree on that.

You made that point already. And I agree with you. What I fail over and over to understand is how that makes HOMM5 a: 1- less valuable game or 2 - less interesting to purchase.

AI - You finally reached a thema that worths discussion.

[ThunderTitan]

What I fail over and over to understand is how that makes HOMM5 a: 1- less valuable game or 2 - less interesting to purchase.

Are you really implying that fancy graphics and looks don't sell games?

Sure, there are way more things wrong with H5, but that doesn't mean you should not want them to fix everything.

[MistWeaver]

Perhaps that way to express yourself was just an extra spice on your anti-HOMM5 retoric, but this whole fall apart thing sounded to me like someone who really thinks that HOMM5 is in the same fragile bankrupcy situation as HOMM4.

That was exactly what game is. It has neigher thought-out gameplay, nor art style. But hey, there is shiny 3D, and in many buy/not to buy cases that was just enough.

The situation with H4 is contrary. It has well thought-out gameplay, and art style. But it was rushed, because 3DO had finance problems.
Oh yes, - and H4 was successful, btw, like all other HoMM games.

If that was not the case, punkt schluss.

Genau

No there aren´t. There are just people with influence enough to make you believe that they know whats beautiful and whats not. Thats the work of art critics, they are not so different from speculators. They`re job is to make you like something that you originally wouldnt, so they can earn money on you and make you buy fony posters of Botero to hang on your living room.

Nonsense. Its like to say that all artists are equal at their skill.
They are not.
Compare this:
http://www.disciples3.ru/gallery/sketch ... ch_014.jpg
and this:
http://www.enchantedlearning.com/dgifs/Dragon_bw.GIF
(I can draw even worse)

And anyone who can be convinsed to buy thing that he dont like / need - is a moron.
Anything else on this matter ?

What I fail over and over to understand is how that makes HOMM5 a: 1- less valuable game or 2 - less interesting to purchase.

I wish that art problem was just with gargoyle - thats what you are missing.

AI - You finally reached a thema that worths discussion.

I've reached it last year while playing demo. So you are late.
But Ill recapitulate it for you. AI in H5:

a) Cheats.
- any fights that not vs human are factitious, and attaker losses are greatly decreased
- on any diff level further EASY - AI needs less resourses for anything to acquire, up untill 33% on HEROIC

b) goes to stupor after few month (HoF 2.0)
c) As Nival said - its designed to lose not to win.

[ThunderTitan]

http://www.disciples3.ru/gallery/sketch ... ch_014.jpg

You know what's funny? I don't really like that dragon, but i do think it's good art...

[MistWeaver]

http://www.disciples3.ru/gallery/sketch ... ch_014.jpg

You know what's funny? I don't really like that dragon, but i do think it's good art...

The point is that this art is better in all ways. The style, technique, manner and matter.
Thats an example of diffrence between work of art and ameteur slapdash. Thats why saying that art is all just about personal tastes - is nonsence.

[Jolly Joker]

Perhaps that way to express yourself was just an extra spice on your anti-HOMM5 retoric, but this whole fall apart thing sounded to me like someone who really thinks that HOMM5 is in the same fragile bankrupcy situation as HOMM4.

That was exactly what game is. It has neigher thought-out gameplay, nor art style. But hey, there is shiny 3D, and in many buy/not to buy cases that was just enough.

The situation with H4 is contrary. It has well thought-out gameplay, and art style. But it was rushed, because 3DO had finance problems.
Oh yes, - and H4 was successful, btw, like all other HoMM games.

If that was not the case, punkt schluss.

Genau

No there aren´t. There are just people with influence enough to make you believe that they know whats beautiful and whats not. Thats the work of art critics, they are not so different from speculators. They`re job is to make you like something that you originally wouldnt, so they can earn money on you and make you buy fony posters of Botero to hang on your living room.

Nonsense. Its like to say that all artists are equal at their skill.
They are not.
Compare this:
http://www.disciples3.ru/gallery/sketch ... ch_014.jpg
and this:
http://www.enchantedlearning.com/dgifs/Dragon_bw.GIF
(I can draw even worse)

And anyone who can be convinsed to buy thing that he dont like / need - is a moron.
Anything else on this matter ?

What I fail over and over to understand is how that makes HOMM5 a: 1- less valuable game or 2 - less interesting to purchase.

I wish that art problem was just with gargoyle - thats what you are missing.

.

What a ridiculous post!

"The situation with H4 is contrary. It has well thought-out gameplay, and art style. "
STYLE? WELL THOUGHT-OUT GAMEPLAY? Boy, if that's your standards that indeed every kindergarden painting is art. H 4 has some of the worst in graphics I've ever seen.
And by the way, there ARE valid criteria for what art is or should be, but that's completely irrelevant here. Art isn't trivial (or better, if it's trivial it can'zt be art), and these things are trivial firt and foremost. As was said, we are not talking about Michelangelo here.
It get's clearer when you compare the music score. Music is art as well as graphics, but no one would have the idea to compare a music score of a computer game with, say, a classic opera or something.
What we are talking about is indeed TRIVIAL and every point made in terms of art is ridiculous. Of course some graphics are better than others. But if you listen to the music charts you can say the same without starting about whether some pieces were art and some not.
That doesn't mean you can discuss graphics with something like "objective criteria":
a) coherent style?
b) originality?
c) ability, that is, the work itself

Did I miss something? Yes, vision maybe, but that has too much to do with art and yould be misplaced in this trivial background.

And, oh, yeah. You have to LIKE it. Whether it's freaking art or not and ESPECIALLY if it's trivial. And I for one just LOVE the Gargoyles. Why? They are original (not the usual gothic-style clichés); they are in keeping with the town theme (coherent); it's well done with lots of interesting details and stuff.
Contrary to that I dislike the Treants. Why? They are a rush job that had to be done due to legal difficulties with the initial design (which obviously means it wasn't original enough).

[Apocalypse]

Hmm, the Gargoyle is original and looks cool, but its flying animations really suck

And btw, I like the Heroes V graphics

This graphic comparison is too subjective (I'm talking in general), because I for one can't believe some say the Warcraft 3 graphics are good (some even mistake the WoW graphics with NWN). Just look at the trees and see how childish they are in WC3. Or how saturated and with no detail the textures are. I mean, it's clearly what's a better graphic when comparing a texture with only one color (can be drawn even in Paint - I know it's exaggerated, but...) and one with more Noise and that stuff.

[Wolfsburg]

I agree with almost every sentence Jolly Joker wrote. If you ideal of graphic qualiy is Heroes 4 I start to understand where our different perspectives start.

I have trouble recalling a game where artwork was so ugly as in HOMM4. But once and again, this brings nothing to the discussion. Art is about binding to the images and primary feelings.

If I came to you and said that your model of a perfect dragon is kitchy and that the dragon drawn by the child is beautiful, you couldnt possibly ever find an argument to make that less legitimate. You can though say that, the first one was drawn by someone with more hability, it is more complex and it is more realistic. BUT, if I find it ugly as hell, there is no way to say that is a wrong opinion. Because?

(In chorus now) The perception of beauty is a subjective sensation!

Everything has its beauty but not everyone sees it.
Confucius (551 BC - 479 BC)

Beauty is no quality in things themselves: it exists merely in the mind which contemplates them.
David Hume (1711 - 1776)

And boy, do I like the art of HOMM5.