Spectral Dragons- Incorporeal Ability

[erased. over. out]

Should they have kept the Spectral Dragon's corporeal ability, or would that have overpowered the Necro's a tad too much? They are undoubtedly the worst of the upgraded dragons. Perhaps a 25% incorporeal ability would suffice? In my opinion, the SDs look and feel corporeal, so they shouldn't have taken this characteristic away.

EDIT: I must've been on crack when I typed up "corporeal." It's "incorporeal" like some of you have rightly pointed out. Apologies for the typo.

[Arstahd]

The word you are looking for is INcorporeal, meaning without body or substance. Corporeal is just the opposite.

If they were to get the Incorporeal ability they would need to lose the growth boost. Three per week with a chance at no damage is too much.

The only problem that I have with them currently is the asinine structure costs. The initial building costs way too much, while the growth booster is too cheap and can actually be built first?!? When I play Necro I often struggle with the Bones, sometimes I can't get them until weeks after I would have had L7's from another faction, negating their only advantage.

[DaemianLucifer]

Ghosts,wraiths and spectrals should all have the incorporeal ability,as they did in the beta.Instead of removing it from creatures,they shouldve nerfed the ability itself.Instead of giving you a 50% miss chance,it should give you a 50% damage reduction.

[LinkStatic]

Instead of giving you a 50% miss chance,it should give you a 50% damage reduction.

How is this much different from simply doubling it's defense or hp? "Incorporeal" is a nice twist to an otherwise dull 50% damage reduction and adds a slight touch of chaotic randomness that every battle needs to be interesting. You know one day we're going to be telling each other stories of how our enemies missed 5 times in a row, thereby allowing you to win an otherwise hopeless situation.

[MrSteamTank]

Instead of giving you a 50% miss chance,it should give you a 50% damage reduction.

How is this much different from simply doubling it's defense or hp? "Incorporeal" is a nice twist to an otherwise dull 50% damage reduction and adds a slight touch of chaotic randomness that every battle needs to be interesting. You know one day we're going to be telling each other stories of how our enemies missed 5 times in a row, thereby allowing you to win an otherwise hopeless situation.

The luck feature is so crippling or beneficial it's insane. I believe soldier's fortune ups the % miss rate of incorporeal. I definitely agree with Arstahd as particularly shadow dragons seem a little weak.

To be honest I loved the skeletal ability skeletons and bone dragons had. Making them strong vs ranged targets with the upgrade for the bone dragons granting them incorporeal. Although if wraiths gained that ability they would need to lose like 30-40% of their hp to remain balanced. This would definitely add to the uniqueness of the race.

However, get rid of the 50% miss rate as that ghost matches are crazy luckfests that personally I do not enjoy.

[Gaidal Cain]

Instead of giving you a 50% miss chance,it should give you a 50% damage reduction.

How is this much different from simply doubling it's defense or hp?

Attack and Defense works with differneses, not quotas, so there's a distinct difference. Doubling HP doubles resistance to spells. So, in H5, an incorporeal that reduces damage by 50% makes perfect sense.

[Naskoni]

IMHO Incorporeal doesn't make for a good unit ability as there is way too much luck into it to make it fun for me - once I had a duel (in the demo) where, believe it or not, a stack of ghosts triggered the ability more than 15 (fifteen) times in a row, which is just insane. There is simply no strategty is such abilities - I wouldn't enjoy winning a battle this way!

I think both B./S.Dragons and Wights/Wraiths need something to make them special as at the moment they feel somehow barren, empty, oversimplified and the nature of the factions simply begs for more abilities.

[DaemianLucifer]

Instead of giving you a 50% miss chance,it should give you a 50% damage reduction.

How is this much different from simply doubling it's defense or hp? "Incorporeal" is a nice twist to an otherwise dull 50% damage reduction and adds a slight touch of chaotic randomness that every battle needs to be interesting. You know one day we're going to be telling each other stories of how our enemies missed 5 times in a row, thereby allowing you to win an otherwise hopeless situation.

Because doubling the defense doesnt decrease damage by 50%.I meant a 50% damage reduction AFTER it has been modified by attack,defense,range and anything else.And it eliminates the dumb luck factor that allows your hundreds of dragons to miss a single ghost.

[cornellian]

Incorporeal on tier7 creatures is just too powerful, I have fought ghosts in the campaigns and in MP and I can tell you, I'm never on the right end of this incorporeal and luck thing, I miss 8-10 times in a row sometimes, which is more than enough for a capable enemy to bring down your army..

However Spectrals are really not very powerful, for reasons stated before: no specials, and hard to build prerequisite structures; and by the way what good is their cursing attack? It only helps moderately when small armies are involved, when I have 20 dragons the chances are very few creatures will be still standing when hit by a spectral anyway, so why give a cursing attack? If huge armies are figthing it still is useless as 80 paladins will kill my dragons, cursed by the spectral or blessed by high heavens..

Perhaps something like a phoenix rebirth would give some dignity to spectrals; kicking in not when they are all killed but after a battle, a la Eternal Servitude (never brought back a dragon by eternal servitude, not even by Markal and I think it can't be done, so it'll be a nice bonus); and it can be put into some context like 'some of your haughtiest dragons refuse to finally die an eternal death'..

[Bandobras Took]

Did we all have the some complaint with Minotaurs in H4? They had the same ability by a different name, but I can't recall them being a vital part of my armies.

[cornellian]

Did we all have the some complaint with Minotaurs in H4? They had the same ability by a different name, but I can't recall them being a vital part of my armies.

They weren't a vital part of your armies probably because you had to choose between them and medusas, and medusa was one dangerous creature...

[ThunderTitan]

As i recall they din't have a 50% chance, just a 20-30% one. And Medusas were too good not to pick them. Maybe if they had 50% Minotaurs would be on par with the snaked haired lady.

[Gaidal Cain]

Minotaurs were annoying back then as well. However, they were slow walkers, and didn't deal quite as much damage, so the blocking was a tad less annoying. Oh, and sometimes, the blocking was more of a handicap than an aid- I've managed to kill a stack of minotaurs in melee once without it getting to retalitate, specifically because of their blocking ability...

[ThunderTitan]

Oh, right, they didn't retaliate either. Maybe the Equi team should increase their chance from 30% to 50%.

[Gaidal Cain]

Of course they retaliated. Only, when the blocking kicked in, it counted as the attacker had first strike. Cue attacking with Thunderbird, Block triggers, Lightning Bolt triggers, and no more pesky Minotaurs

[ThunderTitan]

So never use Minos against Stronghold. Got it.