Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

[Xfing]

I'm trying to repaint the missing MM7 belt - generic male and female versions already done and looking good. But I've run into a problem. I know the item code is v3 for mino, v4 for troll, v5 for dwarf - but the game seems bugged and it displays 7item100v1 for all three of those categories, rather than v3, v4 and v5 respectively. I wonder what could be done about that - is there some data table where some reference might need fixing? I haven't been able to find anything like that, but I suppose

heyyy

maybe knows something about this. Pls help!

And here are what the belts look like, the versions that work at least:


EDIT: Looks like trolls and minos use the male belt variant just like in vanilla MM8, a patch was required to change this which was done in the comm branch but wasn't backported. Bit of a shame, but since MM8 did that too, I suppose it's acceptable (at least temporarily).

I was able to make a slightly wider belt for the dwarf, though - so guess this is ready (for now) to be integrated.



The troll and mino versions also exist, but aren't used by the game for now - and when they are, some slight adjustments to them might be necessary, be it the BMP files or the paperdoll coordinates. Here's a package with everything you need to integrate this belt into the game, alongside a changelog:
EDIT: link removed, this is no longer up to date. look for newer repaints below


While I'm at it, I might take a look at the other belts, since some of them could use a bit of improvement.

[justl]

Another small bug:
- In the shop "Alloyed Armors and Shields" in Tatalia (Tidewater), the Buy Standard and Buy Special menus seem to be swapped - Buy Standard gives much better gear than Buy Special.

can confirm that

[arabezzz]

Hi guys, thank you for your great work! It's so great, MM6 (it's my favourite part) with no limitations in comparison with newer parts

But I think I have a minor bug, my party members have Learning Skill = 7, the mage has Intelligence = 46, but John Tuck refuses to promote them for Learning Skill Masters. (Intelligence level is 36 natural + 10 from ring he's wearing). The same with other party members (with rings and drinking from fountain nearby, they can have Intelligence = 30, too). Save: https://www.dropbox.com/s/iypmy6zsfeyks ... e.dod?dl=0

I had the same problem with Bodybuilding master promotion for Knight, but meditation (doesn't require any skill level) was OK. Looks like some issue with promotions that require some skill level?

[Xfing]

Hi guys, thank you for your great work! It's so great, MM6 (it's my favourite part) with no limitations in comparison with newer parts

But I think I have a minor bug, my party members have Learning Skill = 7, the mage has Intelligence = 46, but John Tuck refuses to promote them for Learning Skill Masters. (Intelligence level is 36 natural + 10 from ring he's wearing). The same with other party members (with rings and drinking from fountain nearby, they can have Intelligence = 30, too). Save: https://www.dropbox.com/s/iypmy6zsfeyks ... e.dod?dl=0

I had the same problem with Bodybuilding master promotion for Knight, but meditation (doesn't require any skill level) was OK. Looks like some issue with promotions that require some skill level?

Hey, some instructions will indeed require an attribute of 50, like master learning (int), bodybuilding (end) or merchant (per), which is taken from MM7 and 8. My guess is that the requirement applies to MM6 teachers too, so the requirements are uniform across the three continents. If a MM6 teacher says otherwise (such as that 30 is required), it's probably just text that wasn't changed. Temporary stat boosts will not do (ones that display in green, like from spells and fountains), but boosts from items that appear to alter your base stat will help you, so you can use magic equipment to get your stat over 50 temporarily to get the instruction. Of course keep in mind that the same stat levels are required for grandmaster instructions.

[Xfing]

Ok, so I actually went ahead and repainted all those belts like I said. No idea how I spent the entire weekend on this, but yeah, at least I'm done doing stuff for M&M for a while now I did the MM7 leather belt again so it's nicer than my previous version, so I'm removing the link in that previous post. The up to date link is now this:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... sp=sharing
As always, you just copy the BMP files into your mmmerge.icons.lod and the txt file with coordinate values into data/tables.

I've redone all the MM6 and MM7 belts from scratch (well, starting with the original versions from those games at least), and also realigned all the belts once again for the troll paperdoll. Male humans, minos and trolls use the v1 file, females use the v2 file and dwarves use the v5 file. With Minos, after some alignment the belts look great so there's probably no need to do anything further with them, while with Trolls, after some alignment work from my part they all look passable as well. Oh, and I've also updated the ITEMS.txt and rnditems.txt files, because based on how the belts look on the paperdolls, I've actually decided the first three tiers need reshuffling - the MM6 belt is now the crappiest, the MM7 one remains in the middle, while the MM8 one is the best out of the three starter belts now. The links to get those files remain the same.

Anyway, here's the gallery if you're curious what the belts look like now. The file is huge so I'm not pasting it into the forum:
https://imgur.com/Z7KpopL

As always: Rodril, pls integrate I could also go and fix the troll/mino cloak situation, but I was told this would be done in the next patch anyway, so I'm not doing it haha! Just make sure you do it on top of the "complex item pictures.txt" file that I'm providing here, since there were some alterations to belt coordinates.

I could also add the existing potion recipes to random loot (since their values are all 0 in rnditems.txt), but I'd rather wait until the recipes for the extra potions are also implemented as items, since that's something I'm not sure how to do myself. I could try to figure that out too, but first I'll need approval - don't wanna drop this on you without even knowing if you feel that's a good change. Anyway, the recipes would be very rare, probably like 0 0 0 2 2 2 or something like that, maybe there could also be a small chance to have them drop by certain alchemically inclined monsters (like Necromancers maybe?) Let me know how you feel about that.

[Rodril]

Hello. Hoping in to thank you for the awesome work with belts!
I have not read all new posts yet, don't judge if i won't answer to something important in this message.

I'm trying to repaint the missing MM7 belt - generic male and female versions already done and looking good. But I've run into a problem. I know the item code is v3 for mino, v4 for troll, v5 for dwarf - but the game seems bugged and it displays 7item100v1 for all three of those categories, rather than v3, v4 and v5 respectively. I wonder what could be done about that - is there some data table where some reference might need fixing? I haven't been able to find anything like that, but I suppose

This is original behaivor, probably NWC tried to reduce memory usage, and hardcoded usage of 'v1' for all paperdolls, except female one. Upon removal items limits i've left it as is, but it won't be hard to change engine to recognize 'v3', 'v4' and 'v5' as well, will do it very soon.

currently i have entered the hive in mm6.
when i am in the hive the game keeps crashing (hard, to windows) without any script messages.
i suppose it comes when the radioactive flood text should appear - but i cant confirm it
justl

Send me "ErrorLog.txt" file from your game folder, please.

As for bugs - I'm getting a fatal crash when switching between party character inventories while inside the Adventurer's Inn. Should be reproducible, since it's the latest version.

Strange, but i cannot reproduce that. Send me your savegame and/or "ErrorLog.txt", please.

I have not got error report about additional quick spells crashing the game, if someone else have it, send console text to me, please.

I was fixing some pathfinding issues, now will focus on most recent stuff.

[Xfing]

This is original behaivor, probably NWC tried to reduce memory usage, and hardcoded usage of 'v1' for all paperdolls, except female one. Upon removal items limits i've left it as is, but it won't be hard to change engine to recognize 'v3', 'v4' and 'v5' as well, will do it very soon.

Figured it out in the meantime I can handle the remaining two paperdoll belt repaints too once the fix is in place. Since that will be relevant to the cloaks too, I can do those too while I'm at it, no problem. Then again, not sure if there are 5 cloak variations in the game as well? Will have to check that. Anyway, Mino belts look good enough as they are, but they clearly don't reach all the way around the mino's waist, so we might want to scale the belt up a bit. I think the same repaint will cover both the mino and the troll, since their bodies are similar enough. If not, I can try doing both to get them just right.

As for bugs - I'm getting a fatal crash when switching between party character inventories while inside the Adventurer's Inn. Should be reproducible, since it's the latest version.

Strange, but i cannot reproduce that. Send me your savegame and/or "ErrorLog.txt", please.

I'll try, but since no one else seems to be getting this error either. Cthscr wasn't able to reproduce it either, so it's probably just something with my game files, might just need a clean install. It's not a serious issue anyway, since it's possible to just restart and reload the game.

Anyway, when playing yesterday I've noticed more issues, many of which I can probably fix myself, such as bits and pieces of dialogue still wrong somewhere: for example the High Priest of Enroth still sometimes refers to his promotion as the Priest of Light - a remnant from before we turned it into High Priest instead. Same goes for Master Wizard (refers to the party as "Arch Mages" in one of his post-completion messages). But I think I remember where the file containing the dialogue is so I can take a pass at all the dialogue options, including that from random hirelings and check for issues, inconsistencies and grammatical errors and just correct it when I can. I could make a changelog too. What I've done in the meantime is adjust ITEMS.txt introducing value, item name and flavor text fixes/changes as per the Tracker. Changed tier values of gemstones too, apart from all other types of gear. Differentiated their loot values in rnditems.txt too, so that every item now has slightly different chances than its neighbors.

And here's a brief rundown of gameplay ascpects that I've noticed might need correcting. Some you will see earlier in the thread, some are new:

- Necromancers are not getting promoted to Master Wizard in Enroth. I think they actually should be included for the promotion, since it's still an improvement for them in every way (they keep being able to use Master Dark Magic), and they're pretty much just a slightly modified Wizard class anyway. I haven't figured out yet if you can get a Necromancer to become an Archmage if chosen the Light path in the MM7 portion, but that's still a lot of hassle if you want to get a Master Necromancer, and being able to get him a Master Wizard first would make that a whole lot easier.

- In fact, as an extension to the above proposal - I think it would be pretty cool if the High Priest and Master Wizard promotors (or some other chosen NPCs) allowed the "Mirrored Path" choice, just like how you can visit the masters of light/dark magic on Enroth to hop between light and dark with your Priests/Archmages. Priests of Light/Dark and Archmages/Master Necromancers should be able to choose to be High Priests/Master Wizards again. Ideally, that would reduce their skill level in Light/Dark from GM to M and erase the GM spell from the spellbook, while allowing them to also learn the other school. Of course the Lich should remain the point of no return, obviously.

- And an optional suggestion for further down the line: maybe bring back Battle Mage/Warrior Mage so that there is a Mirrored promotion for Archers too? The current tier 2 promotion could be renamed from Warrior Mage to Battle Mage (MM6 style), while Warrior Mage could be the final promotion on Enroth. Warrior Mages could get basic Light and Dark, while Master Archers/Snipers could get one of those schools, but up to expert. Not sure if worth it, but it's just an idea - you can switch between the paths easily anyway even today and giving Archers expert in these schools might be overpowered (or both at a time).

- I have noticed that spell and magic vendors seem to be favoring the MM8 learning book format exclusively, including Erathia and Enroth. While you can still find MM6/7 spellbooks in random loot, they're not being sold at shops very much. I think all the learning book cover types should have an equal chance of appearing in any guild: for example for each book of "Lightning Bolt" sold at the Alvar elemental guild, you should have an equal chance of encountering the book with a MM6, MM7 or MM8 cover. Also, the item type for those seems to be "Book of Learning" in MM6 and 7 and "Learning Book" in MM8. I think that should be made more uniform and all the books should share a single item category name (just like I did with MM6 "Gem"->"Gemstone"). Same goes for MM6/7 artifacts/relics. The MM8 ones now say for example "Artifact Halberd" or "Relic Sword" before being identified, while MM6 items just say "Artifact" or "Relic". I think the MM8 ones have a nice system, would be nice to extend that to the remaining items.

- Some artifact/relic bonuses are still not applying, most particularly MM6 artifacts that hadn't been repainted earlier - but you already know that I'm sure.

- Ore has become sellable to shops, which is great - but I've noticed that ore found in Erathia still has a vendor value of 0, rather than the ore with value that you can find on Jadame, and therefore is not sellable. I suggest either deleting one category of ore items (since both are identical, other than the value) - or if it will make things easier, just re-add values to the MM7 variant and make them sellable just like the MM8 ones now are.

- Add elemental splash effects for elementally enchanted weapons - idea described more in detail a bit earlier in the thread.

- Alchemy: add extra recipe scrolls as items (recipe text for each one already suggested in the concept document for the extra potions, which is inside the Tracker). Since they were fixed to be sellable again, consider adding all potion recipe scrolls as rare random loot from tier 3-6 chests and maybe some monsters, that would help a bit with a smoother progression into more advanced alchemy. Also do something about the Protection from Magic potion since it keeps affecting the whole party and not just the drinker. If the effect cannot be coded to be individual, I suggest changing the potion to Pain Reflection. Remaining unused spell effects in the game are only: Hammerhands, Regeneration and Pain Reflection. I think the first two are too weak to be White Potion tier, which leaves just Pain Reflection, which seems appropriate.

I have one final potion idea too - Hour of Power. It would be black and combine the effects of Bless, Haste, Heroism, Stoneskin and Shield in a single potion, just like the spell itself - that should be possible for single characters, since all these effects are granted individually by layered potions. But that's just an idea off the top of my head and I'd have to first come up with a formula, so ignore this for now and just let me know if you think it's worth it or is too much hassle (one can just use the easily mixed layered potions one after another instead, after all).

[raekuul]

Jadamian Knights and Clerics can cross-promote because they actually are those base classes in Merge (in MM8 they were Fighters and Priests, which was roughly equivalent to Enrothian Cavaliers and... Priests). Jadamian Necromancers are a separate class from Enrothian/Erathian Sorcerers and lore-wise explicitly have started on the Dark path with the goal of becoming Liches. There's no turning back, and besides making them Sorcerers would screw with the game balance for a Jadamian start (believe it or not, but early game MM8 is balanced with the expectation that you can cast spells like Toxic Cloud or Reanimate, and not everybody does the Drowning Skip). Similarly, there's no split for the "racial" classes of Troll/Minotaur/Dark Elf/Vampire/Dragon.

Opening up the class to Master Necromancer via Kastore in the Pit would be nice, but ultimately redundant since they have an explicit Lich promotion and due to the promotion shuffling are the only classes that can become Liches now.

With that said, I would like to see the full gamut of "neutral path" promotions for the Enrothian Six and Erathian Nine. We could make the Enrothian "Neutral" branch the base, and then adjust the Erathian "Light"/"Dark" branches as necessary.

[Xfing]

Jadamian Knights and Clerics can cross-promote because they actually are those base classes in Merge (in MM8 they were Fighters and Priests, which was roughly equivalent to Enrothian Cavaliers and... Priests). Jadamian Necromancers are a separate class from Enrothian/Erathian Sorcerers and lore-wise explicitly have started on the Dark path with the goal of becoming Liches.

Yea, but they're identical to Wizards in all respects, with the exception of having access to Dark Magic. Which Master Wizards also have, and up to the same level of mastery. Necromancers should be counted for that promotion IMO.

There's no turning back

You can go back and forth between Master Necromancer and Archmage as many times as you want though... Also, not suggesting Necromancers should be able to revert to Wizards, but they should be promotable to Master Necromancers, just like Enrothian Wizards do when they fully commit to dark magic. It's mostly as an option to preserve the character's unique portrait and voice if you don't want a lich. A lich will still have mind and body immunity and the Regeneration skill as added bonuses to make that an option worth pursuing.

and besides making them Sorcerers would screw with the game balance for a Jadamian start (believe it or not, but early game MM8 is balanced with the expectation that you can cast spells like Toxic Cloud or Reanimate, and not everybody does the Drowning Skip). Similarly, there's no split for the "racial" classes of Troll/Minotaur/Dark Elf/Vampire/Dragon.

No one's talking about sorceres, but wizards, the 2nd promotion branch, which the Necromancer is completely equivalent to, except for the added ability to use Dark Magic. So being able to go from a Necromancer to a Master Wizard should totally be feasible, since Master Wizards also get master in Dark Magic anyway. Also, not true you need dark magic to beat MM8. The game is way easier than even 7 (though part of it comes from the fact that you have five guys rather than four), you totally don't need dark magic early on to progress in the game. Hell, in the current version Talimere no longer even has Light Magic, even though he used to in vanilla. But yea, that's probably because base Clerics are no longer open to that school of magic, so it's not a problem.

Opening up the class to Master Necromancer via Kastore in the Pit would be nice, but ultimately redundant since they have an explicit Lich promotion and due to the promotion shuffling are the only classes that can become Liches now.

Not true. Regular Wizards can do the MM7 lich quest if on the dark path and get promoted. Master Necromancers are still open to the promotion with Lich Jars in Jadame as well. The problem is that you can't get a Necromancer to a Master Necromancer or Master Wizard. It'd be nice to have both.

With that said, I would like to see the full gamut of "neutral path" promotions for the Enrothian Six and Erathian Nine. We could make the Enrothian "Neutral" branch the base, and then adjust the Erathian "Light"/"Dark" branches as necessary.

Yea that might be fun, but it's not practically feasible since that'd require a) a whole new set of quests b) different skill level caps that would even justify it. Hell, most classes in MM7 other than the monk and the spellcasters with Light/Dark don't even really get any different skill caps between the light and dark path promotions. In this situation having neutral promotions for every class would just be clutter.

To summarize, my idea of what could be changed with these promotions (seeing as how you can already freely switch between Archmage and Master Necromancer, likewise with priests) can be illustrated as such:


@Rodril btw here's the error log from that Adventurer's Inn crash. Still think it might be due to some local problems but feel free to take a look:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1oZR5L7 ... sp=sharing

EDIT: Oh, I've just noticed that potion recipes actually DO appear in random loot! Just found one in a chest in the Cyclops Larder - it's for the Freezing Potion. I didn't change anything in the meantime, guess this has been implemented for some time now. Nice. Guess it's just easy to disregard them because they look no different than basic level spell scrolls from mm8.

[justl]

found a wand in tatalia (near lord markhams villa at the trolls) /mm7 with no charges:

edit: found a 2nd wand there (i mean predetermined items from the ground) also with no charges - also an alacorn one (of fireballs)

another predetermined wand found with no charges in barrow downs map
fairy wand (the green ones)

[Xfing]

Yeah, MM7 had some pre-placed wands with no charges ever since vanilla I think. I may have seen one or two in MM8 too. I've also noticed:
- Enrothian mage shop owners tend to say their "thank you" line if you don't buy anything from them, to which a party member comments how rude they are. Not sure if that's intended (the shopkeeper wants to be passive-aggressive), or a mismatch in the game data.
- The extra potion recipes actually also are in the game, and appear in random loot. Sorry for not noticing earlier! But there are a few minor things to fix with them: they are all worth 1k gold, when the white potion ones should be 750, there are some mistakes with their text (like the Essence of Accuracy scroll contains the text for the Essence of Luck recipe for example), the names are not capitalized and the new potion recipes don't appear at alchemist stores. I'll try to fix all these issues myself, update the items.txt file accordingly and let you know.

[Xfing]

Okay, I've looked into the potion recipes. I fixed the spelling, the capitalization and the values. I also gave the potion recipes the same sprite index and mod1 and mod2 property values as the original recipes (from MM8) - now they display all info accurately and neatly. However, that was not enough to get them to start appearing at shops, so there must be some other variable that determines that, which I can't find anywhere. I'll leave that part to you. ITEMS.txt is updated again, in the usual location and the other file (scroll.txt) is in a folder with the link below.

But while I was at it, I've also updated game text for class descriptions (visible in the character creation skill) in class.txt to reflect the mechanics of the Merge more accurately, for example removing the redundant MM8 text saying that only Clerics can learn Light Magic (Clerics, Sorcerers, Archers and Paladins can). Unfortunately the Stats screen doesn't display the class name in MM8, so there doesn't seem to be a way to bring this text up in the game proper.

Then in stats.txt I've update the descriptions of some Stats screen elements. For example, the Intellect stat doesn't now just say that it gives spell points to Necromancers and Dark Elves, but more reflective of reality: Sorcerers, Archers, Druids, Rangers, Dark Elves, Thieves and Dragons. Likewise for the Personality stat.


Then in Skilldes.txt I've added descriptions to skills that were lacking Grandmaster descriptions (this text was mostly unchanged all the way from MM6 days) or info about skill availability that is no longer valid.



(I've actually fixed the Shield description in the meantime saying more accurately that expert level makes the shield no longer slow the character down, while only at master does the defensive bonus double).

All the files can be found in the folder below, and just like ITEMS.txt they only need to be imported into mmmerge.T.lod to take effect.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... sp=sharing

[cthscr]

Jadamian Knights and Clerics can cross-promote because they actually are those base classes in Merge (in MM8 they were Fighters and Priests, which was roughly equivalent to Enrothian Cavaliers and... Priests).

Fighters and Priests are in W8 (Wizardry 8), not MM8 MM8 has Knight and Cleric that correspond to Cavalier and Priest of MM6.

Jadamian Necromancers are a separate class from Enrothian/Erathian Sorcerers and lore-wise explicitly have started on the Dark path with the goal of becoming Liches. There's no turning back, and besides making them Sorcerers would screw with the game balance for a Jadamian start (believe it or not, but early game MM8 is balanced with the expectation that you can cast spells like Toxic Cloud or Reanimate, and not everybody does the Drowning Skip). Similarly, there's no split for the "racial" classes of Troll/Minotaur/Dark Elf/Vampire/Dragon.

Opening up the class to Master Necromancer via Kastore in the Pit would be nice, but ultimately redundant since they have an explicit Lich promotion and due to the promotion shuffling are the only classes that can become Liches now.

1. Necromancer corresponds to Wizard. 2. Separating Lich and Master Necromancer classes wasn't a thing in Comm Merge since April 2020.

With that said, I would like to see the full gamut of "neutral path" promotions for the Enrothian Six and Erathian Nine. We could make the Enrothian "Neutral" branch the base, and then adjust the Erathian "Light"/"Dark" branches as necessary.

What do you think is in work since April 2020?

[cthscr]

As for bugs - I'm getting a fatal crash when switching between party character inventories while inside the Adventurer's Inn. Should be reproducible, since it's the latest version.

Strange, but i cannot reproduce that. Send me your savegame and/or "ErrorLog.txt", please.

That was a bad description of activity. Later reporter admitted he mixed potions and used spell scrolls inside Inn. Still don't cause a crash to me but you can get UI error [after] using item targeted spell scrolls (yes, using spell scrolls inside Inn is forbidden in MM8).

[Rodril]

Figured it out in the meantime I can handle the remaining two paperdoll belt repaints too once the fix is in place.

Actually, i've forgot. Individual pictures for belts are already implemented, but this option is toggleable for each belt, to enable recognizng of "v2" and "v3" pictures, you have to put "x" sign in "Complex" column of "Complex item pictures.txt" table from your "Data\Tables" folder - in "Belts" section.

That was a bad description of activity. Later reporter admitted he mixed potions and used spell scrolls inside Inn. Still don't cause a crash to me but you can get UI error [after] using item targeted spell scrolls (yes, using spell scrolls inside Inn is forbidden in MM8).

I've found out reason for this error: MM engine have limit for amount of icons in use - 1000 (one thousand icons) - including not only item icons, but interface icons aswell, thus game always have above 500 slots in use. Merge contain a lot of different item icons and if party have 5 character and each of them have full inventory of different items, this bug happens. Even outside of adventurer's inn. Error raises at 0x410e06.
Here is savegame, where bug can be reproduced (just enter Inn, open mercenary's inventory and start switching inventories with Tab button):
https://www.dropbox.com/s/p8sazhw5bm9q6 ... 7.dod?dl=0
I have not found solution yet, just added crutch in my branch to prevent crashing.

[Xfing]

Actually, i've forgot. Individual pictures for belts are already implemented, but this option is toggleable for each belt, to enable recognizng of "v2" and "v3" pictures, you have to put "x" sign in "Complex" column of "Complex item pictures.txt" table from your "Data\Tables" folder - in "Belts" section.

Nice! 30 more repaints for me to do then, I guess. Oh well BTW, should I also try cloaks, or is that already done in the comm branch and awaiting reintegration?

As for implementing a full neutral path questline to MM7, well that's definitely a grand effort and I'm curious of the end result to be sure! As far as the promotions go, personally I only really care about High Priests/Master Wizards because of the rare ability to wield light and dark magic together as a single character. That's probably the single most rewarding difference - otherwise very often dark and light promoted classes have no differences from each other whatsoever, so a third class wouldn't really bring anything new to the table. Unless it had overhauled skill limits of course.

Anyway: what kind of teacher do you need to visit to get a mino peasant to become of the Minotaur class? It's possible to get the Dark Elf and Vampire classes right now. I've noticed that suspiciously enough, Axe teachers don't offer to get you Minotaur and regeneration teachers don't offer to get you Troll - and of course those would be the logical ones to do so. Is there a way in the game now to get those classes?

EDIT: Okay, I've confirmed now that there is no way to get the Mino and Troll classes through the same means. I think it'd be nice if that were possible, the suggested skills for that being Axe and Regeneration, respectively. Which brings me to the next thing: I don't think minos being restricted to master in Axe was a good decision. I definitely agree with them getting GM bodybuilding, since in vanilla they actually had less HP than humans (who also had master BB and they're hulking bull monsters, so it makes sense they should be tougher than human knights and only inferior to Monks, Dragons and Trolls (on par with the first, maybe? I don't recall the base hp values). But restricting them to mastery in Axe just so Rangers can have something to call their own? Probably not such a good move. Axes are pretty much the signature of Minotaurs, they're portrayed wielding them everywhere they're seen - it's a bit hard to buy that they can't even GM the axe. I know Rangers need some love and all that, but they didn't even have exclusive Id Monster grandmastery back in MM7, sharing it with Sorcerers. It doesn't really detract from Rangers in any way if Minos can GM axe too. Please consider restoring that level for them.

[Xfing]

Ok, I did the troll and mino belts. Really it just came down to scaling them up by 10%, that did the job. I know it's a bit lazy, but I really didn't feel like spending as much time as I did last time, and the effect is an improvement. I've updated the files in that shared drive, along with Complex item pictures.txt.

I think I'll try enabling that option for cloaks and see what they look like, since it's possible they don't actually need any work and the currently present V3 and V4 versions can be used with no issues.

EDIT: Okay, so while the repainted versions of vhe cloaks exist in T.lod already, the game is not reading them for some reason if "complex" is enabled for them. It's probably a bug - anyway the cloaks most likely don't need any repaint work since she troll/mino shoulders have already been repainted. What's left to do is figure out a way for the game to recognize the pictures, since v1 cloaks won't really look all that good, especially those that cover the shoulders from the front.

[justl]

hi,

some odd mm7 behavior:
in the tunnels beneath stone city the mages summon either water elementals (from the water mages) or fire elementals (from fire mages)
whilst the water elementals do fight the gogs down there, the fire elementals simple float around doing nothing

justl

edit: air elementals from air wizards also do fight there
i havent been to nighon yet, will look there, if all 3 elementals go vs me when im in nighon mountain there

edit2:
when it comes to rooms with much fire wizards it looks like this (and the game performance is becoming a mess of stuttering sound and rubberband effects

[Xfing]

Oh yeah, and in Escaton's Palace, the behemoth clones can cast Sunray. Indoors

I know that's supposed to replace the Paralyze spell which was coded not to work (the game would have been mad hard if it did), but it should prolly be replaced with some less story-breaking spell.

[justl]

hi,
another thing ive seen down there:

the enemys (gogs) are running up the wall, disappear into it and the dangerzone goes back to green (pretty sure it wasnt vanilla)
(see minimap for red enemy-dots - though they reappear, when you leave and reenter the dungeon)