Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

[Templayer]

I use the Fly scroll to read the obelisk...

I remember a long time ago I climbed that mountain (on my Pentium 133, my first ever PC), it took so long because it was a slow CPU, after minutes of pressing forward to climb that mountain, I plunge immediately and read the obelisk, then realized I was stuck in there and can't get out lol...
Today, I tried climbing again with my current PC (i5 gen 3 CPU) it took only a few seconds to climb to the top..

I also remember using the door bug, where you just stand in front of a locked door (any door, including Tomb of VARN, and MM7), save the game, then load the game while running forward, because of the slow CPU to render the door, I always able to get through without doing all the quest.. lol.
In Lord Markham's manor, if I get through without opening the door (using the bug), I can get inside without being attacked.. hahah good ol days...

Hah. I remember playing Prince of Persia on a PP06 computer. It was so slow that you could run in air for a moment, before the game realized that you should be falling. That was mildly hilarious. The PP06 was made by TESLA.

For the Door bug: I do not think that it is because CPU was rendering the thing too slowly, it is just because the game renders the level and then adds doors into it, so the first one or two frames after loading a game the doors aren't loaded yet. I think. What they should've done was enable the player controls AFTER everything is loaded properly. It might be an oversight, though. The doors are a bit janky in MM6 when compared to MM7 and MM8, so in MM6 the doors might have been an "addition towards the very end" and they simply forgot to make it a part of the loading process for the map or something. And then for MM7 and MM8, it was pretty much copy paste, so even though they made doors less janky, the save-loading didn't change that much for doors, I think.

GrayFace or Rodril should be able to explain the real cause better, mine's just theories. I used it to gain access to the rest of Harmondale Castle early.

I presume that vanilla glitch won't by fixed by GrayFace because it can only be specifically exploited by the player that really wants to exploit it, and there is no detriment to it, so I won't add that to the Bug Tracker. (it's a glitch that you can pretty much only encounter if you REALLY, REALLY want to encounter it)

[fanasilver]

Guys, is there a way to make a peasant become a Ranger in MM6?
I tried Perception expert, the Armsmaster in Free Haven, and also the Axe expert in Castle Ironfist, but no luck..

[Templayer]

Guys, is there a way to make a peasant become a Ranger in MM6?
I tried Perception expert, the Armsmaster in Free Haven, and also the Axe expert in Castle Ironfist, but no luck..

Crud. Someone really should make a tutorial on where to find all the teachers that weren't teaching or existing in vanillas.

[Thonkerton]

Guys, is there a way to make a peasant become a Ranger in MM6?
I tried Perception expert, the Armsmaster in Free Haven, and also the Axe expert in Castle Ironfist, but no luck..

ID Monster teachers can make a Ranger and MM6 doesn't have ID Monster Teachers unless Rodril added some.

Edit. Might be useful to have the Peasant promotion skills listed nicely in the Tracker alongside the Promotion guide.

[Daedros]

Exactly, thus I don't like the "repeatable Dragon Familiar quest" thing and especially if Brimstone will become a Gold Dragon while Duroth the Eternal would become a Black one.

A bit late, but Brimstone should be the Black Dragon, while Duroth the Eternal be the Gold. Brimstone's locale (Shadowspire) suits it, and he does share many similarities with the Vampiric Smoke Drake, Capnolithyl (aka Brimstone) from D&D's Forgotten Realms. Capnolithyl was transformed into a Vampire by Sammaster (an insane lich, very similar to Zanthora the Mad). Sammaster then discovered how to create Dracoliches, which Sammaster deemed to be superior to Vampiric Dragons, so he discarded Capnolithyl.
Duroth the Eternal is a huge, elder Dragon. Gold Dragons are often the most prestigious and venerable members of their species.

[Templayer]

Exactly, thus I don't like the "repeatable Dragon Familiar quest" thing and especially if Brimstone will become a Gold Dragon while Duroth the Eternal would become a Black one.

A bit late, but Brimstone should be the Black Dragon, while Duroth the Eternal be the Gold. Brimstone's locale (Shadowspire) suits it, and he does share many similarities with the Vampiric Smoke Drake, Capnolithyl (aka Brimstone) from D&D's Forgotten Realms. Capnolithyl was transformed into a Vampire by Sammaster (an insane lich, very similar to Zanthora the Mad). Sammaster then discovered how to create Dracoliches, which Sammaster deemed to be superior to Vampiric Dragons, so he discarded Capnolithyl.
Duroth the Eternal is a huge, elder Dragon. Gold Dragons are often the most prestigious and venerable members of their species.

We actually had this dialogue here (about the DnD Brimstone homage in the M&M universe) months ago. Agreed.
EDIT: We considered making him a Blood Dragon (the Vampire variant for Dragons) once that is finished.

Edit. Might be useful to have the Peasant promotion skills listed nicely in the Tracker alongside the Promotion guide.

It certainly would, and a list of trainer locations that either weren't trainers or didn't exist in vanillas would compliment that quite well.

[Templayer]

By the way, Rodril said that some of the non-Merge (i.e. stuff not translated by me) texts have been translated into Czech by using Google Translator. I haven't looked yet, but because unlike other languages (Russian and English are pretty decent) it sucks, I may have to fix it.

Some funny examples:




I expect something similar for the google translated parts of the Czech translation, but I haven't had the courage to look yet.

[mimickxd]

Hi, just wanted to ask, in traditional MM7 there was a relic/artifact hard limit from what I remember.
Is there any limit like that in MM Merge? Also, what happens if I sell an artifact etc.? Would I be able to obtain it again later, also does that allow me to get another artifact (if limit exists)?

I tried finding this info in tracker, but there is literally too much data :p.

Thanks for reply!

[candida]

Hello,

Recently, I've started getting an error message when I start the game (it still runs perfectly after closing the window):

Code: Select all

... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\DataTablesSupport.lua:355: assertion failed! (file "Data/Tables/Class Skills.txt" - row 13, column 23 - value " M")

stack traceback:
	[C]: in function 'assert'
	... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\DataTablesSupport.lua:355: in function 'f'
	... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\DataTablesSupport.lua:117: in function <... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\DataTablesSupport.lua:101>
	[C]: in function 'pcall'
	... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\DataTablesSupport.lua:154: in function 'SkillsStd'
	... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\RemoveClassLimits.lua:120: in function 'f'
	...y\Games\Might and Magic 8\Scripts\General\DataTables.lua:54: in function 'DataTable'
	...y\Games\Might and Magic 8\Scripts\General\DataTables.lua:81: in function 'update'
	...y\Games\Might and Magic 8\Scripts\General\DataTables.lua:161: in function 'v'
	Scripts/Core/EventsList.lua:68: in function <Scripts/Core/EventsList.lua:63>

arguments of 'f':
	c = 21
	sk = 11
	v = " M"

local variables of 'f':
	(*temporary) = (table: 0x04a9b798)

upvalues of 'f':
	StrToNum = (table: 0x04cd0d00)
	NumToStr = (table: 0x04ef37f8)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 

[Templayer]

Hi, just wanted to ask, in traditional MM7 there was a relic/artifact hard limit from what I remember.
Is there any limit like that in MM Merge? Also, what happens if I sell an artifact etc.? Would I be able to obtain it again later, also does that allow me to get another artifact (if limit exists)?

I tried finding this info in tracker, but there is literally too much data :p.

Thanks for reply!

No, the limit was removed. There is another limit in place - some artifacts should exist only once, so from what I remember the game now checks (upon like map entry or something) if an artifact exists somewhere when generating loot. But beware - this check also includes things like the Garrote Gorge Dragon Hoard, which you do not get access to if you side with the dragons, which means that artifact won't generate anywhere else... I do not remember how that was solved. Except for invisibility and then skedaddling.

Hello,

Recently, I've started getting an error message when I start the game (it still runs perfectly after closing the window):

Code: Select all

... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\DataTablesSupport.lua:355: assertion failed! (file "Data/Tables/Class Skills.txt" - row 13, column 23 - value " M")

stack traceback:
	[C]: in function 'assert'
	... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\DataTablesSupport.lua:355: in function 'f'
	... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\DataTablesSupport.lua:117: in function <... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\DataTablesSupport.lua:101>
	[C]: in function 'pcall'
	... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\DataTablesSupport.lua:154: in function 'SkillsStd'
	... and Magic 8\Scripts\Structs\After\RemoveClassLimits.lua:120: in function 'f'
	...y\Games\Might and Magic 8\Scripts\General\DataTables.lua:54: in function 'DataTable'
	...y\Games\Might and Magic 8\Scripts\General\DataTables.lua:81: in function 'update'
	...y\Games\Might and Magic 8\Scripts\General\DataTables.lua:161: in function 'v'
	Scripts/Core/EventsList.lua:68: in function <Scripts/Core/EventsList.lua:63>

arguments of 'f':
	c = 21
	sk = 11
	v = " M"

local variables of 'f':
	(*temporary) = (table: 0x04a9b798)

upvalues of 'f':
	StrToNum = (table: 0x04cd0d00)
	NumToStr = (table: 0x04ef37f8)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 

I can actually see where the problem is - one of the table values contains " M" instead of "M".
Open ../Data/Tables/Class Skills.txt with GrayFace's Table edit, find row 13, column 23 and remove the surplus space to fix the problem.
Have you edited the file? Or did you get it from somewhere? Or is it in the update? If it is in the update then I need to add it to the Bug Tracker.

EDIT: GrayFace's text table editor can be downloaded from here.

[Thonkerton]

The artifact/relic limit is not quite as rigid as that, though I assume it depends on the place. Escaton's Palace can have multiple of the same artifact even if you arrive with said artifact in the inventory, I don't recall the exact circumstances but I ended up with 3 or 4 Thors (mm6 artifact). As I understand, Escaton's Palace has some special artifact spawning rules anyway, they might clash with other artifact rules. Personally I wouldn't really mind having no limits for the artifacts/relics as I play with Bolster on and majority of artifacts are actually detrimental, especially with weapons as most artifact weapons are inferior to rusty club as long as it has Of Darkness or Vampiric (with bolster on). Even when playing vanilla style, a huge number of artifacts and relics are still decidedly mid-tier while also being selective about who to give them to.

I don't know how much heresy it'd be to alter some of these artifacts to have their value more accurately represent their real usefulness or to make some currently lower tier artifacts and relics more powerful while adding some drawbacks. Relics that are given lofty descriptions of providing godly powers and then only give +30 Speed (Lucius) which is pretty meaningless, especially when considering that stats provide less bonus the more you have of it and magical buffs giving hundreds of attribute points. From what I've seen only artifact items for Liches are generally always useful and better than anything they could ever hope to have and can also utilize few artifacts that are "meant" for other classes like Druids, for everyone else it's hit and miss.
Granted, stacking artifacts does also grant immense power, especially for the lich, as they can pretty much triple Dark Magic or a specific Elemental school by doing this, clerics can also roughly double or triple their light magic or a Self magic school as the +50% to skill stacks from artifacts +50% from a single trinket. For contrast, the only boon fighter classes can get from artifacts is very specific double damages or static bonuses to Armsmaster, no +50% to fighting skills, then again, arguably they don't need any.
Not really suggesting any particular changes, just writing out loud.

[kkkender]

Hello! Used the search for these troubles, didn't find anything, so maybe I'm first:

1. Game crashes on selecting mm6/7 UIs (maybe depends on UI chosen on start, I had 8th).Also crashes when using dimensional door with "UI depends on continent" setting. The error message is "Excepcion ELayout exception in module MM8Patch.dll at 000642F3. UI Layout, line 60: Negative coordinate: (53, -21 .. 106, 31)."

2. Cannot open the vault behind the portrait in Fort Riverside. I opened it once, but lost the scroll and decided to try take it once again. The portrait flashes red as a hidden object, but nothing happens when clicking at it. Oracle doesn't return it as "Lost it" option.

3. It's my first run on MM7, so my knowledge of quests is from internet, but it seems like travelling between worlds breaks story quest in MM6. I expected (here's the internet info, correct if wrong) that in a month quests "save erathian spy" and "get fort plans to the elves" would expire, and the war would begin; also, a year after judge Grey would die. So I took the quests from kings, left Antagarich for other timelines and a year later returned to see nothing changed. Now, i'm travelling within the continent for a second month to see if something would finally happen.

4. Thank you for this merge! I have great fun playing three games as one

upd. forgot this one: some time after rescuing Sharry from the Shadow Guild in Ironfist (the quest was fully completed), I returned to this dungeon, and Sharry was there again. She followed me as an NPC, and now I can't get rid of her, because she doesn't have "dismiss" button, and Frank seems to not need a second Sharry

[Templayer]

Hello! Used the search for these troubles, didn't find anything, so maybe I'm first:

1. Game crashes on selecting mm6/7 UIs (maybe depends on UI chosen on start, I had 8th).Also crashes when using dimensional door with "UI depends on continent" setting. The error message is "Excepcion ELayout exception in module MM8Patch.dll at 000642F3. UI Layout, line 60: Negative coordinate: (53, -21 .. 106, 31)."

2. Cannot open the vault behind the portrait in Fort Riverside. I opened it once, but lost the scroll and decided to try take it once again. The portrait flashes red as a hidden object, but nothing happens when clicking at it. Oracle doesn't return it as "Lost it" option.

3. It's my first run on MM7, so my knowledge of quests is from internet, but it seems like travelling between worlds breaks story quest in MM6. I expected (here's the internet info, correct if wrong) that in a month quests "save erathian spy" and "get fort plans to the elves" would expire, and the war would begin; also, a year after judge Grey would die. So I took the quests from kings, left Antagarich for other timelines and a year later returned to see nothing changed. Now, i'm travelling within the continent for a second month to see if something would finally happen.

4. Thank you for this merge! I have great fun playing three games as one

upd. forgot this one: some time after rescuing Sharry from the Shadow Guild in Ironfist (the quest was fully completed), I returned to this dungeon, and Sharry was there again. She followed me as an NPC, and now I can't get rid of her, because she doesn't have "dismiss" button, and Frank seems to not need a second Sharry

I've added you to the Bug Catchers' section on the Credits Tracker. The tracker is in my signature (I do not know if you checked it or not.)
Point 3 might actually not be a bug - the time might count WHILE you are in the said time-space (i.e. continent). Makes sense in a trans-dimensional sense.
The Sherry bug might have been reported already.
Anyway, I added all of them to the Bug Tracker.
Thanks for reporting.

EDIT: That UI crash might be something for GrayFace, actually.

I gave a breath of new life to Enroth. Bow down before me, for I am your Redeemer!

*bumps GrayFace*

[mimickxd]

Hi, thanks for an answer.
I also have a question about Castle Lambent and Malwick - Stanley quest. I have to steal "Big Tapestry " from the castle, the problem is that when I do, Throne Room gets closed, when I don't, Harmondale gets destroyed. I tried using e.g. invisible spell, but the action of grabbing that item make castle hostile to my party (which is without sense as how do they know it was my party who has stolen this thing?). Has this issue been already resolved or..?

I also have 1) bug, that kkkender wrote.

Also, when I use Town Portal, sometimes it "breaks" and teleports me randomly somewhere. Is it a bug or should it work like that?

Apart from that, elvish guard in Pierpont Castle are named "guard', while all others have Capital Letters in their names.

EDIT: also, small question.
I decided to do a long way promotion via cleric - priest - high priest - priest of the light (it sounded most profitable and logical to me).
The thing is, I already have a high priest, I made a quest for priest of the light, but my high priest wasn't promoted. In the chart there in tracker there is a line with MM6 high priest -> priest of the light promotion, but how would I do that?

[SpectralDragon]

Exactly, thus I don't like the "repeatable Dragon Familiar quest" thing and especially if Brimstone will become a Gold Dragon while Duroth the Eternal would become a Black one.

A bit late, but Brimstone should be the Black Dragon, while Duroth the Eternal be the Gold. Brimstone's locale (Shadowspire) suits it, and he does share many similarities with the Vampiric Smoke Drake, Capnolithyl (aka Brimstone) from D&D's Forgotten Realms. Capnolithyl was transformed into a Vampire by Sammaster (an insane lich, very similar to Zanthora the Mad). Sammaster then discovered how to create Dracoliches, which Sammaster deemed to be superior to Vampiric Dragons, so he discarded Capnolithyl.
Duroth the Eternal is a huge, elder Dragon. Gold Dragons are often the most prestigious and venerable members of their species.

We actually had this dialogue here (about the DnD Brimstone homage in the M&M universe) months ago. Agreed.
EDIT: We considered making him a Blood Dragon (the Vampire variant for Dragons) once that is finished.

Then frankly you 2 will have to take it to Rodril himself, since when I last spoke to him about said stuff, he decided that neither of them will be their "alternate" selves (Brimstone being Gold and Duroth the Eternal being Black) and I said what I've said because Gold Dragons are based off Brown ones (like Brimstone) while Black ones are based off Red ones (like Duroth the Eternal), as I've shown on this very forum. If Rodril then still doesn't wish to make said changes, then there's nothing I can do and you 2 will have to make the changes (including changing Brimstone to Red Dragon in order to get the Black one and Duroth the Eternal into a Brown Dragon in order to get the Gold one, once and if the Gold one is even implemented) on your own selves.

Sorry.

[SpectralDragon]

Hi, thanks for an answer.
I also have a question about Castle Lambent and Malwick - Stanley quest. I have to steal "Big Tapestry " from the castle, the problem is that when I do, Throne Room gets closed, when I don't, Harmondale gets destroyed. I tried using e.g. invisible spell, but the action of grabbing that item make castle hostile to my party (which is without sense as how do they know it was my party who has stolen this thing?). Has this issue been already resolved or..?

This is from vanilla and it's intended. I, personally, just allow Harmondale to be attacked by Stanley's minions because at least in vanilla, their attack is seriously nothing special, since only Goblins and hostile Adventurers are included (having your respective ally's castle locked down and its residents hostile for at least one in-game year is a MUCH worse thing to have than a silly dinky attack I you ask me). The real issue is hunting every single last sodding one of them down in order to "unlock" Harmondale again and yes, this also includes investigating your own castle from top to bottom.

That's why I generally just kill Malwick with Dragonflies.

As for kkender's Town Portal bug, please, answer me this: Is your Water Magic marked as Master or Grand?
Since being able to choose the place of your Town Portal destination is meant for Grand-level Water Magic.

[Templayer]

Hi, thanks for an answer.
I also have a question about Castle Lambent and Malwick - Stanley quest. I have to steal "Big Tapestry " from the castle, the problem is that when I do, Throne Room gets closed, when I don't, Harmondale gets destroyed. I tried using e.g. invisible spell, but the action of grabbing that item make castle hostile to my party (which is without sense as how do they know it was my party who has stolen this thing?). Has this issue been already resolved or..?

I also have 1) bug, that kkkender wrote.

Also, when I use Town Portal, sometimes it "breaks" and teleports me randomly somewhere. Is it a bug or should it work like that?

Apart from that, elvish guard in Pierpont Castle are named "guard', while all others have Capital Letters in their names.

EDIT: also, small question.
I decided to do a long way promotion via cleric - priest - high priest - priest of the light (it sounded most profitable and logical to me).
The thing is, I already have a high priest, I made a quest for priest of the light, but my high priest wasn't promoted. In the chart there in tracker there is a line with MM6 high priest -> priest of the light promotion, but how would I do that?

1. See SpectralDragon's response - you made the deal with the Devil in disguise, and there are consequences.
2. Town Portal - tell us more information, like the level you are using it at, where you use it and where it teleports you.
3. Typo added to the Bug Tracker for now. (we once had a Typo Tracker )
EDIT: 4. Please remember that you are not miraculously gaining skills if you do your promotion route. Promotions work simply by changing your class to a class that has different max. skill expertises. You can however get Mastery and Grand-Mastery in skills that you would lose by that promotion, and then get promoted, which would cause those maximums to be in red, but you retain your skill points and expertise level. (we had a problem here with Racial Skills, which is available on the tracker as an optional modification, whereas if you make a Vampire Necromancer and you turn into a lich, you lose your Vampire race, thus you lose your Vampiric Abilities as well...). Added to the Bug Tracker. Either that is a bug in-game, or a bug in the Promotion Chart.

[Templayer]

Exactly, thus I don't like the "repeatable Dragon Familiar quest" thing and especially if Brimstone will become a Gold Dragon while Duroth the Eternal would become a Black one.

A bit late, but Brimstone should be the Black Dragon, while Duroth the Eternal be the Gold. Brimstone's locale (Shadowspire) suits it, and he does share many similarities with the Vampiric Smoke Drake, Capnolithyl (aka Brimstone) from D&D's Forgotten Realms. Capnolithyl was transformed into a Vampire by Sammaster (an insane lich, very similar to Zanthora the Mad). Sammaster then discovered how to create Dracoliches, which Sammaster deemed to be superior to Vampiric Dragons, so he discarded Capnolithyl.
Duroth the Eternal is a huge, elder Dragon. Gold Dragons are often the most prestigious and venerable members of their species.

We actually had this dialogue here (about the DnD Brimstone homage in the M&M universe) months ago. Agreed.
EDIT: We considered making him a Blood Dragon (the Vampire variant for Dragons) once that is finished.

Then frankly you 2 will have to take it to Rodril himself, since when I last spoke to him about said stuff, he decided that neither of them will be their "alternate" selves (Brimstone being Gold and Duroth the Eternal being Black) and I said what I've said because Gold Dragons are based off Brown ones (like Brimstone) while Black ones are based off Red ones (like Duroth the Eternal), as I've shown on this very forum. If Rodril then still doesn't wish to make said changes, then there's nothing I can do and you 2 will have to make the changes (including changing Brimstone to Red Dragon in order to get the Black one and Duroth the Eternal into a Brown Dragon in order to get the Gold one, once and if the Gold one is even implemented) on your own selves.

Sorry.

And this is why we should already have a Merge.ini file with options.
OptionalContent_AlternateDragonHirelings
default value = false

And an installer where you can check those as checkboxes.
As most such big mods do.

[Thonkerton]

Also, when I use Town Portal, sometimes it "breaks" and teleports me randomly somewhere. Is it a bug or should it work like that?

I decided to do a long way promotion via cleric - priest - high priest - priest of the light (it sounded most profitable and logical to me).
The thing is, I already have a high priest, I made a quest for priest of the light, but my high priest wasn't promoted. In the chart there in tracker there is a line with MM6 high priest -> priest of the light promotion, but how would I do that?

Using Town Portal as Dimension Door for other continents/times teleports you to a randomish place with hilarious and potentially deadly result, I assume that works as intended, are you referring to that or just normal Town Portaling?
Also, you may need to choose Dark/Light path before your high priest becomes Priest of the Light/Dark. You can choose it by going to Dark/Light teachers and telling them "yes" when prompted, if you're playing an older version of the game, the player text input is bugged and you may need to tell them "yes" few dozen times before it registers properly.
Edit. choosing a path in MM7 may also work for the priest of light/dark, haven't tested that though.

[Templayer]

Just checked, still no speedruns of the Merge as of yet.

Edit: Also still waiting for that one insane guy that does the impossible and finishes the whole game with a lvl 1 Zombie Peasant.