New Games, Old Feel?
I don't think so, Dalai; we are very selective and preserve only those memories we hold the fondest. I have played many games, but only remember a few with fondness. Those are the games I think about when thinking back to the "glory days".
In War: Resolution, In Defeat: Defiance, In Victory: Magnanimity, In Peace: Goodwill.
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hellegennes
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New Games, Old Feel?
I may have to agree with Dalai on this. On many occasions IT IS just nostalgia but there are also true quality indicators. Even arts have real measures of aesthetic quality, it's not just a matter of opinion. I have very fond memories of the original Civilization, but I think Civilization V is an excellent game and I truly enjoy it. So it's not just memories that do the job. Heroes 6 was flawed. I enjoyed the game but it was flawed. I didn't enjoy MM9, not because the good old days were behind me, on the contrary, it was because it was awful.
Too me it's pretty simple, why new versions of xcom/civ/starcraft are exepted and why heroes is not, with the first bunch they buffed up the grafx, played a bit with the controls and added new things, but they didn't chance the core game, with heroes it's an other story, nothing wrong with better grfx but taking half the recources away , making sure you don't have to bother taking mines/dwellings (cos some people may find that boring) and making every town build the exact same is deff changing the core game...
Keep your friends close... And your enemy's closer !
New Games, Old Feel?
I agree with Lomedae, the first poster.
This is a nicely worded article that fails to conceal the pro-Ubisoft bias the moderators on this website/ forum have been forced to feign in order to maintain good relations with that company.
I find that the feeling I get when I play starcraft and diablo now is different from over 15 years ago.
However, I don’t feel that these are lousy games or that my money and time has been wasted. Granted, I don’t feel young anymore, but I don’t feel cheated either.
I don’t think Heroes VI comes across the same way.
I’m sure most of us would prefer not to use transistor radios anymore. We would prefer to carry around an iphone or smartphone with our favourite songs on it. But that doesn’t mean a malfunctioning or badly made iphone is better than an Android. Just because there is only one company making the iphone, doesn’t mean that we should smile broadly and say thank you when that company is producing crap iphones.
Going by that analogy, I have stopped using iphones. I am on Android now (Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3.) I am not dreaming of the days when I used the Mac SE and Mac Plus (for those who don't know, they are Apple products from the 1980s). I just want a functioning Iphone. Is that too much to ask?
This is a nicely worded article that fails to conceal the pro-Ubisoft bias the moderators on this website/ forum have been forced to feign in order to maintain good relations with that company.
I find that the feeling I get when I play starcraft and diablo now is different from over 15 years ago.
However, I don’t feel that these are lousy games or that my money and time has been wasted. Granted, I don’t feel young anymore, but I don’t feel cheated either.
I don’t think Heroes VI comes across the same way.
I’m sure most of us would prefer not to use transistor radios anymore. We would prefer to carry around an iphone or smartphone with our favourite songs on it. But that doesn’t mean a malfunctioning or badly made iphone is better than an Android. Just because there is only one company making the iphone, doesn’t mean that we should smile broadly and say thank you when that company is producing crap iphones.
Going by that analogy, I have stopped using iphones. I am on Android now (Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3.) I am not dreaming of the days when I used the Mac SE and Mac Plus (for those who don't know, they are Apple products from the 1980s). I just want a functioning Iphone. Is that too much to ask?
I'm offended by that. To say that I am "on the take", having been forced somehow by Ubisoft to issue an article with a positive take, is ignorant at best. If you have any knowledge about the workings of CH the last couple of years, you will recall that I have been one of the most critical voices; in public statements I have time and again engaged the company directly, attacking their flawed policies - e.g. the DRM and their online system. We are also adamant that despite our intentions to be on a good footing with anyone involved in the M&M Community, our independence comes first. So let's just get that clear.
On the other note, I think you're right about the quality issue, but as has been pointed out by others, that wasn't the focus of this article. It's the feel of the thing that we want, while obviously taking into account that any game we play should also be of some degree of quality.
On the other note, I think you're right about the quality issue, but as has been pointed out by others, that wasn't the focus of this article. It's the feel of the thing that we want, while obviously taking into account that any game we play should also be of some degree of quality.
In War: Resolution, In Defeat: Defiance, In Victory: Magnanimity, In Peace: Goodwill.
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CloudRiderX
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New Games, Old Feel?
"This is a nicely worded article that fails to conceal the pro-Ubisoft bias the moderators on this website/forum have been forced to feign in order to maintain good relations with that company."
...or maybe the community has an anti-Ubisoft bias.
"The problem is that the new RPG is catering to such a small niche commercially that they even resorted to charging for the bloody Alpha version."
The niche community is people like you who are never happy. They're having players test an alpha because its way cheaper to throw out the alpha and move on than make the whole game just to have people like you boycott it.
...or maybe the community has an anti-Ubisoft bias.
"The problem is that the new RPG is catering to such a small niche commercially that they even resorted to charging for the bloody Alpha version."
The niche community is people like you who are never happy. They're having players test an alpha because its way cheaper to throw out the alpha and move on than make the whole game just to have people like you boycott it.
"A Guardian is always prepared." - Galio, the Sentinel's Sorrow
Re: New Games, Old Feel?
Although I totally share your pain about the latest Heroes games, I think you are wrong assuming Kalah has a hidden agenda. All he says is there is one more way to look at our feelings, and he has a point. May be it's not equally true for everyone (it is not for me), but it's not to be dismissed without thinking.cjlee wrote:This is a nicely worded article that fails to conceal the pro-Ubisoft bias the moderators on this website/ forum have been forced to feign in order to maintain good relations with that company.
And I am definitely sure it is not some PR stunt from Ubisoft. They are physically incapable of admitting something gone wrong. "May be it is not a 100% success, just 98,57%. Because all things with Ubisoft mark is great at the very least". Otherwise an army of lawyers will be summoned to punish the blasphemy. I don't see this kind of BS in the article at all.
A well earned one, I must add.CloudRiderX wrote:...or maybe the community has an anti-Ubisoft bias.
"Not a shred of evidence exists in favour of the idea that life is serious." Brendan Gill
New Games, Old Feel?
When somebody is peddling BS as a good product, if you try to put a positive spin on it as 'fertilizer' or 'well processed recycled material from cow intestines' I would consider that a bias.
All the same I don't blame you personally. I suspect many of the moderators have been holding their noses these few years, understanding that if they are too critical, they won't get interviews and sneak peeks and other goodies from game developers.
I am also suspecting many people who worked on H6 feel frustrated at the way things turned out. They can't be proud of the final product.
But consider things this way. The internet now is many times bigger than it was compared to the days of Astralwizard. There should be many times more gamers and forummers. But the action on the forums is pathetic - less than Astralwizard back in the 1990s.
You can see for yourself how little interest there is in H6.
I don't think there is anything you can do. It's entirely up to Ubisoft to produce something marginally decent for H7. I just finished Diablo 3 Hell, and don't think I can go any further (it was really hell). Reality is that gamers play lots of games, and no one can keep playing the same game no matter the quality. Ubisoft doesn't have to equal Blizzard; it only has to produce a H7 that doesn't let down the franchise so badly. With such a low bar set by H6, it shouldn't be too hard to produce something tolerable for me to play until they come up with Starcraft 2 Protoss expansion.
That said, I found H6's story so crap that I didn't feel like playing MMX. Anything set in that world is not interesting to me.
All the same I don't blame you personally. I suspect many of the moderators have been holding their noses these few years, understanding that if they are too critical, they won't get interviews and sneak peeks and other goodies from game developers.
I am also suspecting many people who worked on H6 feel frustrated at the way things turned out. They can't be proud of the final product.
But consider things this way. The internet now is many times bigger than it was compared to the days of Astralwizard. There should be many times more gamers and forummers. But the action on the forums is pathetic - less than Astralwizard back in the 1990s.
You can see for yourself how little interest there is in H6.
I don't think there is anything you can do. It's entirely up to Ubisoft to produce something marginally decent for H7. I just finished Diablo 3 Hell, and don't think I can go any further (it was really hell). Reality is that gamers play lots of games, and no one can keep playing the same game no matter the quality. Ubisoft doesn't have to equal Blizzard; it only has to produce a H7 that doesn't let down the franchise so badly. With such a low bar set by H6, it shouldn't be too hard to produce something tolerable for me to play until they come up with Starcraft 2 Protoss expansion.
That said, I found H6's story so crap that I didn't feel like playing MMX. Anything set in that world is not interesting to me.
@cjlee: You can keep claiming your ignorant point of view all you like, it doesn't make it any more true. Nobody here at CH (least of all me, who is solely responsible for this article) will agree to kowtow to the producers of any game with the aim of getting into their "good graces". It is and has always been our main policy. Independence before good relations, although we will certainly have both if we can. If you actually believe what you're saying, you cannot possibly have any clue as to what has been going on here the last several years and I encourage you to browse through the news forum for some of my more critical editorials about Ubisoft and their policies. If you insist on maintaining your accusation, I will require you to back them up with something tangible.
It also seems that you have missed the point of this article. It is neither praising nor rubbishing the games Ubisoft have made, it is in fact not about the actual quality of the games at all, but whether they "feel" right. As I said at the beginning, we're nostalgics, one and all, and what we want is games that "take us back" to the feeling we had when we played games in the olden days. As far as MMX is concerned, I do hope it turns out to be a good game, but we'll have to wait and see on that one. What looks promising, though, is the intention of "going back to the roots" as they call it; I think that might appeal to many a fan. If the game turns out to be absolute crap, however, the feel it creates won't be enough to cover up the lack of quality. Again, we'll have to wait and see if it's any good.
It also seems that you have missed the point of this article. It is neither praising nor rubbishing the games Ubisoft have made, it is in fact not about the actual quality of the games at all, but whether they "feel" right. As I said at the beginning, we're nostalgics, one and all, and what we want is games that "take us back" to the feeling we had when we played games in the olden days. As far as MMX is concerned, I do hope it turns out to be a good game, but we'll have to wait and see on that one. What looks promising, though, is the intention of "going back to the roots" as they call it; I think that might appeal to many a fan. If the game turns out to be absolute crap, however, the feel it creates won't be enough to cover up the lack of quality. Again, we'll have to wait and see if it's any good.
In War: Resolution, In Defeat: Defiance, In Victory: Magnanimity, In Peace: Goodwill.
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hellegennes
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New Games, Old Feel?
@cjlee:
Ahem... Ubisoft is a far better producer than Blizzard. Blizzard just found the right strategy of pushing their games. When you consider that Diablo 3 was in development for the past decade, the result is utterly pathetic. It is a super hyped game, which is just good; not great; not excellent; just good. WoW is also lacking as a game. Even Ultima Online, released seven years earlier, was much better in terms of gameplay (not to mention innovation).
If you consider how many games Blizzard and Ubisoft publish per year and then compare their overall quality, you would find that Blizzard only has marketing strategy against Ubisoft. It's pretty much like Apple: "hey, our new iPhone has a camera, that's innovation!"
Ahem... Ubisoft is a far better producer than Blizzard. Blizzard just found the right strategy of pushing their games. When you consider that Diablo 3 was in development for the past decade, the result is utterly pathetic. It is a super hyped game, which is just good; not great; not excellent; just good. WoW is also lacking as a game. Even Ultima Online, released seven years earlier, was much better in terms of gameplay (not to mention innovation).
If you consider how many games Blizzard and Ubisoft publish per year and then compare their overall quality, you would find that Blizzard only has marketing strategy against Ubisoft. It's pretty much like Apple: "hey, our new iPhone has a camera, that's innovation!"
In two days, I'll have been here two years and I've never read nor felt a serious bias.(about the HoMM Franchise anyway) 
From my pov the MMs and HoMMIV seem to dominate at this site but that's because of Fans & Mods. "In general", I think this is true because HC has a strong grip on H3 and the folks that prefer H4 and the RPGs come here.
I'm not saying my pov is accurate but it could be true, since I've been supporting H5 at 3 sites. MMX is the only new activity, so by default, any good HoMM site should be supporting that effort and this site is doing that. As far as H6...it went-dead everywhere, at nearly the same moment.
However, I didn't see any connection to any of this in Kalah's post about "what we may be seeking" in gaming. To me he wrote a very good article on what makes us tick and was offering one likely reason, why we die-hards (and I am one) drag our feet on the new stuff.
@Marzhin
Good Luck with "going back to the roots." I'm rather skeptical these days but I know, you at least, are as dedicated to this franchise as any of us. Cheers
From my pov the MMs and HoMMIV seem to dominate at this site but that's because of Fans & Mods. "In general", I think this is true because HC has a strong grip on H3 and the folks that prefer H4 and the RPGs come here.
I'm not saying my pov is accurate but it could be true, since I've been supporting H5 at 3 sites. MMX is the only new activity, so by default, any good HoMM site should be supporting that effort and this site is doing that. As far as H6...it went-dead everywhere, at nearly the same moment.
However, I didn't see any connection to any of this in Kalah's post about "what we may be seeking" in gaming. To me he wrote a very good article on what makes us tick and was offering one likely reason, why we die-hards (and I am one) drag our feet on the new stuff.
@Marzhin
Good Luck with "going back to the roots." I'm rather skeptical these days but I know, you at least, are as dedicated to this franchise as any of us. Cheers
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GreatEmerald
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astral76minor
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New Games, Old Feel?
Definitely not a first, though I agree. Another way of making games feel like they used to is to involve friends in the multiplayer setting. With friends, the games are much more fun than being alone. In the now is a good idea, but it helps to get involved with others as well. Good statement, Kalah.
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