"The Ship" level is driving me mentally crazy!!!

[Wahooka]

I started this level thinking that I could just casually accumulate resources, take over the Inferno, and then slowly build an army to fight the elves.

I was rudely awakened when I tried to attack the Inferno and faced an army about 4 times the size of mine.

I quickly quit the game and started from the beginning.

This time I decided to take over the elf village first, which seemed to be a great strategy. I took over most of the resources and created an amazing accumualtion of 100 plus army of unicorns, ents, hunters, etc...

Suddenly I was attacked not once, but twice, by Elf heroes, and I soon realized that I was again outnumbered about 4:1.

I quickly quit the game and started from the begininng.

This time, I headed straight for the Inferno. Much more luck this time, I quickly defeated the orange player after less then a week. I felt I was on the right track this time.

I then proceeded to take over all the resources on the dungeon level... seemed a great idea, and eventually I accumulated a nice army of succubus, hell hounds, devils, pit fiends, etc...

TO MY COMPLETE SHOCK, I was invaded by 2 elf heroes who again had me completely dominated, and wiped me out easily.

This level seems completely rigged at this point.

I have started over for a 4th time now, having probably over 200 saved games in my folder at this point.

I've gone a bit mental trying to solve this... not ready for a walkthrough, but I am ready for a nervous breakdown.

[Wahooka]

UPDATE:

I've managed to take over another elf town, so now I own 2 cities at once.

I'm hoping I've finally made the breakthrough that I needed to solve the level!!!

[TheMeInTeam]

In preparation for an upcoming let's play of this game, I've been going through the campaigns on heroic for practice. I beat this level recently on heroic. The only really noteworthy/important skill I had on Agrael at this point was war machines with ballista + first aid tent. I of course also had dark magic, but I don't think I had things like puppet master or blind just yet (built up mage guilds and got some of that later on this map)

The easiest way to beat this map is to ignore everything you don't immediately have to fight (you do have time to clear hostiles off a few mines, but try not to stop too much) and instead rush out 2 elf towns + inferno. If you have expert logistics (you absolutely should since it's a witch hut skill in 1st map) you can capture two elf towns, then inferno town by the end of week 1. After capturing 2nd elf town, hire a hero run him towards inferno. Use him to offload Agraels troops in between turns so they don't defect, until agrael gets too far ahead. I captured Inferno town week 1 day 7. Needless to say, this left green completely crippled and I jumped their last town before week 2 ended. You don't need war machines though; dark magic or generally anything that got you through mission 3 (which was much harder) will work in mission 4 if you attack early. I didn't even do the shadow dragon quest, I just killed them later with inferno troops only lol.

If it works on heroic, you can probably pull it off on any other difficulty also.

[Wahooka]

Well right now I've captured 3 cities... its only a matter of time before I solve this level hopefully.

[ShadowLiberal]

TheMeInTeam is right, ballista's can be quite powerful, though unless you have the all campaigns in TOTE mod you can't get the flaming arrow or triple ballista abilities, which greatly limit this strategy. If you do have war machines though, then it is worth seizing the elf town ASAP just to buy a ballista and first aid tent.

[Wahooka]

I have taken over 3 towns now, but I just attacked the garrison and there are about 700 troops there.

This level is crazy, I don't really know what else to say!

I don't even want to solve it anymore

[mr.hackcrag]

It sounds like you would enjoy single player maps more than campaign maps. Try those instead. Less frustration.

[Wahooka]

I FINALLY BEAT THE SHIP!!!!

Took me over 7 weeks, 100 saved games, and a lot of agony.

I actually think my strategy turned out to be the most efficent, I will outline it quickly here, in case anyone needs a walkthrough.

1. Agrael can use his elf army to its maximum before they desert. You can take over all of the Inferno and one elf village and all the surrounding resources using just those troops.

2. After you have 2 cities, you can mass produce and take over the next 2 elf cities.

3. Once you have all 4 elf cities, you need to give Agrael at least 300 master hunters, or you won't succeed on the final battle.

WHEW!!! Glad thats over.

BTW, I don't think War Machines would have made a huge difference in this victory, but I could be wrong.

[TheMeInTeam]

You can capture 3 cities by the end of week one on heroic, so that's probably more "efficient" lol. Also note that heroes do NOT desert off anybody except Agrael, so you CAN keep most of your elf troops if you cap a tavern ASAP.

You don't need war machines to accomplish it, they're just nice to have because the ballista (even 2 shot version) freaking hurts and the first aid tent can res. In a random map you'd only want to bother with them on a specialist, but in campaign having expert war machines with ballista + first aid = clear all mines without losses even vs shooters (provided they do less than 300 damage to your stack), except the annoying druids/mages. It's a tremendous tool to cheese rush maps and is basically the might equivalent to rushing out a map with powerful destructive spells or summoning. When I talk about using war machines, I'm talking about taking multiple cities in the opening two weeks with a combo of units that's the equivalent of having a few level 7 troops. The longer the game goes, the weaker war machines get. Use the early advantage.

The other reason I really like the skill in campaigns is that the AI doesn't rush you with them and they get weak as time goes on, so they somewhat gimp heroes that you build up and wind up having to fight later while helping you all the same.

However, even a statistically worthwhile Agrael with no spells at all can take 3 towns week 1 as long as he has expert logistics. You need nothing else, but considering you just beat mission 3, you probably have a relatively decent hero.

Pretty much any decent army and magic school (dark or light preferred on agrael, though summoning is probably fine too with guaranteed phantom forces and so many elf towns) will make short work of the garrison.

[Wahooka]

I don't see how you managed to take 3 cities in a week, that seems nearly impossible.

As for war machines, I don't see why they are more powerful at the start of the game, and less powerful later on.

Do you mean because the number of creatures in the army is much less, so it has more impact on the outcome?

[ShadowLiberal]

I don't see how you managed to take 3 cities in a week, that seems nearly impossible.

As for war machines, I don't see why they are more powerful at the start of the game, and less powerful later on.

Do you mean because the number of creatures in the army is much less, so it has more impact on the outcome?

Yes, that's why, armies and neutral stacks tend to be smaller and weaker, so a powerful ballista that only grows stronger when you gain attack or knowledge stats isn't quite as powerful later on.

But even in a big army, a high level hero with the proper skills can still over 600 damage a turn (or for really high level heroes with the right skills over 1,000 damage a turn). That basically turns the ballista into a tier 7 creature that occupies an 8th slot in your army.

As for how to capture 3 towns in the first week, logistics, ballista/magic, and only going for enemy heroes/towns and important treasure/areas you pass.


Here's a tip in campaigns that can come in handy. If a campaign is too difficult and you keep on getting killed by a very powerful hero with a huge army after a few weeks/months, try restarting the campaign and rushing the enemy the first week.

Sure you'll be quite weak, and have a pathetic army, but often so will the enemy. Once you have 2 towns it'll be easier to build up an army to take out the remaining enemy towns, especially if you can capture a 2nd enemy town before the second week starts (that way you get to recruit that town's weekly growth, not the enemy, at times even if you know you can't hold onto a town for more then a few day's it's still worth taking it for a day at the start of the week just for this reason).

[Tyber Zann]

This one had my n*ts in a vice as well. Till I started abusing the scout chasing A.I. I used decoy heroes to lead their 2 elf dudes on a wild goose chase while Agrael went all inferno. (I took the first elf town asap, then got 2 decoys their and waited till they tried to reclaim, then took off. It took them almost a week to cetch me (they always stop for stray resources and such, and I kept hiring new decoys at every opportunity. It was costly, but much less costly than losing Agraels army. (Also, yes, send a mule with Agrael to transfer army back and forth to avoid deserters)

[cjlee]

I, too, was totally crushed on this map at first.

Until I consulted Maltz's walkthrough and realized it was also telling me how to play the Demon Lord/ INferno faction.

Hit hard, hit fast in early game, present a moving target when pursued by stronger foes, take advantage of openings and unguarded castles, etc.

If there was a map that really impressed onto me how to play this faction, this was it.

I normally go for the skills that help in the long run aka skills that need plenty of investment, but these work best for Wizard. Once I'd realized the logic of the Demon Lord, I went for the skills that gave me an early edge - ballistics.


Hard as this map is, in looking back, it fully illustrated how to play a Demon Lord, especially when not backed by your own race, your own castle or anything that gating can bring you.

The master hunters were great, weren't they? Raelag's attack is so much more awesome than anything a Sylvan hero can do for his hunters!

[TheMeInTeam]

IMO this map is a cakewalk compared to necro 5, warlock 3, and sylvan 2 .