Idea for manna consumption

[ecsunotos]

So far, in HoMM series, when hero cast a spell ( especially in combat ) to damage enemy troops, manna consumption has already been set. The spell always get maximum damage and consume whole points of manna.
e.g. Eldritch Arrow spell for 1000 damage will take 50 points of manna. So, when hero cast the spell, the damage will be 1000 and manna consumption is 50 points.
I think it'll be more efficient if there is a feature to set manna consumption each time hero cast a spell in order to get certain damage point needed.
e.g. if a stack of enemy troop will be destroyed by Eldritch Arrow just by 100 damage points, we can set the consumption of manna of 5 points.

[konfeta]

Dunno. This will really just buff early game damage spells by making them more mana efficient and won't do much late game.

Damage spells just needs a better scaling mechanism.

[Mirez]

that would make high knowledge heroes unbeatable

[Tress]

In most cases you can use cheaper spell instead. For example to chose between lightning bolt or cheaper eldrich arrow/fist.
What i think would be useful is ability to downscale spell to lower mastery rank just in case. Like it was done in new King bounty series, where by pressing alt/shift you could downscale spell for cheaper rank or to avoid mass effect of spell.

[MattII]

In most cases you can use cheaper spell instead. For example to chose between lightning bolt or cheaper eldrich arrow/fist.
What i think would be useful is ability to downscale spell to lower mastery rank just in case. Like it was done in new King bounty series, where by pressing alt/shift you could downscale spell for cheaper rank or to avoid mass effect of spell.

That sounds a bit like one of the ideas I had, which was that a spell had an effect-per-cost, and you decided every time how much you were willing to spend.

[vicheron]

that would make high knowledge heroes unbeatable

They could just cap the maximum amount of mana you can spend on a spell. They can also have diminishing returns after a certain point where you have to spend 3 or 4 times the mana to double the damage.

[SplinterHoMM]

Yes, adjustable mana cost is very interesting to me.But we already have (in H5) mana consumption reduced by hero (sometimes creature) skills/abilities and artefacts.Some heroes, like Nur, could use low level spells unlimitedly.

What i'm interested in more is possibility to increase spell damage ('empower') by using more mana (like (1mana x spel lvl) for every 10% increase).

[ecsunotos]

In most cases you can use cheaper spell instead. For example to chose between lightning bolt or cheaper eldrich arrow/fist.

What I think is that we can use even cheaper than the cost of cheapest spell.
e.g. with Eldrich Arrow we can have 100 dmg with manna cost of 8. But, what I think is if we need only 50 dmg to destroy a stack of enemy troop, why we have to use 8 manna with 100 dmg ? It'll be more efficient if hero can adjust the manna cost to, let say 50%, to become 4 manna to obtain 50 dmg.
It's very usefull for the beginning where hero have a low manna point because it'll make hero use his / her manna efficiently.

What i think would be useful is ability to downscale spell to lower mastery rank just in case. Like it was done in new King bounty series, where by pressing alt/shift you could downscale spell for cheaper rank or to avoid mass effect of spell.

That can be an interesting idea too

Yes, adjustable mana cost is very interesting to me.But we already have (in H5) mana consumption reduced by hero (sometimes creature) skills/abilities and artefacts.Some heroes, like Nur, could use low level spells unlimitedly.

What I've got in mind is that ability to control manna consumption can be applied to all heroes and not just for specific hero

What i'm interested in more is possibility to increase spell damage ('empower') by using more mana (like (1mana x spel lvl) for every 10% increase).

Please give us an example

[SplinterHoMM]

I suggest empowered spells are available to multiple factions (not necessarily all) through special perk.Hero can empower his lightning depending on his mana.
Well, lets say lightning does 50 dmg normally,is a lvl3 spell and costs 8 spellpoints, hero has 30 mana.He can empower his lightning up to 70% max using 29 mana (8+(3x70)/10).Sorry, i'm not very good with formulas, but hope its clear enough .

Natural limitation here is mana pool.Possible implied limitation can be not more than 100% increase (double dmg) or hero level, so that lvl5 hero can empower his spells up to 50% and lvl15 hero up to 150% (numbers just for example, can be tweaked to balance).

[ThunderTitan]

Nah... sounds like too much trouble for too little an effect... and it would take out the need to choose if you will spend mana on that dmg spell now or keep it for later, or on what stack you should cast it.


What they need to do is make dmg spells scale in some way with stack numbers, so they don't become rather useless in the late game.

[SplinterHoMM]

Well, you still could use nonempowered spell version...

What they need to do is make dmg spells scale in some way with stack numbers, so they don't become rather useless in the late game.

I think hero should increase his spells dmg with every level, not just with Spell Power stat and skill proficiency.

[ecsunotos]

I suggest empowered spells are available to multiple factions (not necessarily all) through special perk.Hero can empower his lightning depending on his mana.
Well, lets say lightning does 50 dmg normally,is a lvl3 spell and costs 8 spellpoints, hero has 30 mana.He can empower his lightning up to 70% max using 29 mana (8+(3x70)/10).Sorry, i'm not very good with formulas, but hope its clear enough .

Natural limitation here is mana pool.Possible implied limitation can be not more than 100% increase (double dmg) or hero level, so that lvl5 hero can empower his spells up to 50% and lvl15 hero up to 150% (numbers just for example, can be tweaked to balance).

It's exactly the opposite of my idea, but nice thought, IMHO. This idea makes the big idea of manna consumption controlling to become more flexible.
So, hero can either reduce or empower spell damage by controlling the manna consumption proportionally.
It'll make spell to become effective and efficient.
This is quiet usefull for hero at the begining of the game when they just have a little manna.
Off course Developer should find good formula for the calculation.

Nah... sounds like too much trouble for too little an effect

This idea makes manna consumption to become efficient at early stage of the game. Saving 3-5 manna points at that stage is very usefull, IMHO

[ThunderTitan]

Nah... sounds like too much trouble for too little an effect

This idea makes manna consumption to become efficient at early stage of the game. Saving 3-5 manna points at that stage is very usefull, IMHO

Or they could stop being lazy and just add more spells... H5 had way too few for my taste.

Well, you still could use nonempowered spell version...

What they need to do is make dmg spells scale in some way with stack numbers, so they don't become rather useless in the late game.

I think hero should increase his spells dmg with every level, not just with Spell Power stat and skill proficiency.

Nah, then we'd get less difference between might and magic heroes, or even between magic heroes that are specialized in different areas.

But it kinda looks like might heroes might not even get spells anymore, which will be annoying, i preferred to be able to make them into anything i want, even if it's not the most efficient build.

[ecsunotos]

Nah... sounds like too much trouble for too little an effect

This idea makes manna consumption to become efficient at early stage of the game. Saving 3-5 manna points at that stage is very usefull, IMHO

Or they could stop being lazy and just add more spells...

What do you mean by "being lazy and just add more spells ?

But it kinda looks like might heroes might not even get spells anymore

are there any information about this ?

[ThunderTitan]

What do you mean by "being lazy and just add more spells ?

Like if you had more spells you could have a 1 mana dmg spell so you wouldn't be wasting any mana if you just need to do small amount of dmg.

are there any information about this ?

The faction .pdf's mention that the Hell Knight and Paladin have abilities that resemble Chaos and Light magic respectively.

[SplinterHoMM]

...................
Nah, then we'd get less difference between might and magic heroes, or even between magic heroes that are specialized in different areas.

You're mistaken here.Adding the same value (like bonus from being lvl10) does not change the difference between two heroes.

... i preferred to be able to make them into anything i want, even if it's not the most efficient build.

I also ...

[ThunderTitan]

...................
Nah, then we'd get less difference between might and magic heroes, or even between magic heroes that are specialized in different areas.

You're mistaken here.Adding the same value (like bonus from being lvl10) does not change the difference between two heroes.

It changes the similarities between them by adding one more though... better to add something that adds to the differences imo.