Tactics = IMBA

[Banedon]

1) No, I told you that you have 3 speed points to distribute.

How do you get 3 - and only 3 - speed points? And if you're serious on using only 3 speed points, I will also refuse to fight you. 3 speed points allow you to match my Assassins' speed, but do not allow me anything meaningful. You aren't honourable, either.

3) If that morale on your lowest speed sorcere wasn't a joke, I don't even think I will fight you. You aren't honorable enough.

I was waiting for you to point that out Suit yourself. I'm going to win anyway.

All my troops have +1 morale and all yours have zero, at the start of battle, FYI.

Explain.

4) Your cloud of confusions failed a lot of times. For example, on my p1 you had about 13% chance to succeed... on my monk that was 30% or such. Yet you seemed to fail almost all of them. Maybe there is something we dont know, but in the game you failed them regularly and I succeeded with ALL my blinds (on 35% magic resist targets though) and most my cowardices

Bug. I suggest we transfer to the mathematically-governed hypothetical battle.

[csarmi]

How do you get 3 - and only 3 - speed points? And if you're serious on using only 3 speed points, I will also refuse to fight you. 3 speed points allow you to match my Assassins' speed, but do not allow me anything meaningful. You aren't honourable, either.

I did not use it to match your assasins' speed. They had speed 9 and my priests went up to speed 8 and 7 respectively. Actually, my best interest is to keep my speed [/i]lower[/i] than yous assasins'.

And if you still don't get what's the problem with your sorceress morale joke, I suggest we wouldn't fight. I don't care anyways, it's an almost sure win for me. I will build another army you have no hope against, btw. That'll be a quite reasonable and logical one, knowing that my opponent is chaos.

I was waiting for you to point that out Suit yourself. I'm going to win anyway.

Not really. You are almost sure to lose.

All my troops have +1 morale and all yours have zero, at the start of battle, FYI.

Explain.

I already did. My general gives +1 morale to all. Your reaver doesn't. You have units of two alignments, thus zero morale. I still think your bonus is better btw, but if you insist that he be a general, I won't protest.

Bug. I suggest we transfer to the mathematically-governed hypothetical battle.

I suggest I make the moves on my comp. It's easier and more reliable, plus it will work just like heroes does. There can be things out there that we don't know. Plus, it's easier to do random in that and it will be a h4-random (that is not exactly random).

[wimfrits]

I suggest I make the moves on my comp. It's easier and more reliable, plus it will work just like heroes does. There can be things out there that we don't know. Plus, it's easier to do random in that and it will be a h4-random (that is not exactly random).

If you are in need of an impartial party to simulate the battle, I can do so.
But only after you reach agreement on the starting line-ups

[csarmi]

That might be too slow. We'll see.
I might be able to send you the starting save, however (it's in equi).

I can simulate it just as well anyways. Banedon can't, he has no equi?!

[Banedon]

You can't simulate it just as well. What would you call a 13% chance-to-work Cloud of Confusion, or a 100% Blind? Do you call that fair, and do you think it represents what we know of the mathematics of Heroes 4?

I did not use it to match your assasins' speed. They had speed 9 and my priests went up to speed 8 and 7 respectively. Actually, my best interest is to keep my speed lower than yous assasins'.

My own view is that you should attempt to outspeed my assassins, but if you don't think so it's fine with me. But one thing. We fight without speed boosts. It allows you to regulate your move-order in a way I can't. These speed boosts help you, but they don't help me.

I already did. My general gives +1 morale to all. Your reaver doesn't. You have units of two alignments, thus zero morale. I still think your bonus is better btw, but if you insist that he be a general, I won't protest.

I would rather my hero be a General, but Reaver is fine too.

[csarmi]

For me the best scneario is if your assasins move before my priests. That way they can't do any harm, because they either:

a) wait; in that case they will simply lose their turns later (I will cowardice/swarm/blind/whatever them); but even if they don't, there is really nothing they can do at the end of turn 1 and I will start turn 2... or if I simply cast Mass Speed, your assasins will have to finish turn 1 before my priests if that is my wish

b) cast their cancels right ahead; in that case I will cast Mass Chaos Ward or such spells and I'll be protected for the full duration of turn 1 (I'll be protected under your sorcerers' turns, etc)

Besides, I did nothing with my move order with that +2/+1 boost... I had 8(666666) and now it is 8(876666); all the same

[Banedon]

It allows you to outspeed my Assassins after your Mass Speed. Not fair.

You can cast Cowardice, Wasp Swarm, Blind or whatever on them because, due to some bug, they always succeed. In this duel we're fighting an idealization, and my Assassins are going to wait. Let's see what you can do, and if you'll spend your Druid's turn casting Wasp Swarm.

[csarmi]

It allows you to outspeed my Assassins after your Mass Speed. Not fair.

You can cast Cowardice, Wasp Swarm, Blind or whatever on them because, due to some bug, they always succeed. In this duel we're fighting an idealization, and my Assassins are going to wait. Let's see what you can do, and if you'll spend your Druid's turn casting Wasp Swarm.

Well in my game they didn't succeed always, but they did most of the time. And that's what you should expect anyways, they have a 70% chance or so...

[Banedon]

I'm giving my Assassins the Expert Magic Resistance your Fireguard has, thanks.

[csarmi]

you won't get anything more than basic resist on them
they are casters
my fireguard however, is a tank, he has only combat skills; plus a few magic thought from huts and chaos picked to make him fireguard, that's all

sure he has magic resist... he is a combat hero

[Banedon]

Your Fireguard happens to have Advanced Chaos. Is it so hard to build the same for my Assassins? They, after all, only require Advanced Death. I only need Advanced Death, then the rest of the levels can be channeled to Combat.

[csarmi]

my fireguard ahs adv chaos just to have the most skills in that area... he wont be using chaos spells anyways, we can assume (its even more realistic) that he has only basic chaos, basic conjure and some of basic/life/nature/order

[Banedon]

So what? Because your Fireguard has Advanced Chaos and Expert Magic Resistance, my Assassins can do the same.

You seem also to be tweaking the game in your favour. If that is so, I'd rather not battle you (you're as dishonourable as I am )

[csarmi]

So what? Because your Fireguard has Advanced Chaos and Expert Magic Resistance, my Assassins can do the same.

You seem also to be tweaking the game in your favour. If that is so, I'd rather not battle you (you're as dishonourable as I am )

he has no adv chaos anymore... it was only an error btw...
he has basic chaos, basic conjure, basic order, basic life

[Banedon]

Let's see:

My Assassins are level 5.
Level 5 heroes have gained 4 levels and thus learned a minimum of four skills.
1 level of Death Magic + 3 levels of Magic Resistance = 4; Combat I can learn from huts.
Even forgoing Expert Magic Resistance, I should have at least Advanced. Basic is not enough. Advanced.

[csarmi]

i am tired of this discussion and won't continue it

see you

[Banedon]

As am I, but for what it's worth I'm claiming a victory and you, for all your much-vaunted knowledge, are wrong.

[csarmi]

Funny cause I claim victory too... and you are wrong again

[ThunderTitan]

I also claim victory... just because.

[Banedon]

To all neutral observers out there, this is the way I see this battle.

At the start, the Assassins will wait. One of csarmi's Life Priests will cast Mass Chaos Ward, the Druid will cast Mass Fortune and the other Life Priest will wait. The Fireguard and General will attempt to disable my Assassins, but with their 70% Magic Resistance chances are at least one of them will stay active. The Champions too will wait, hoping for Mass Fervor and a pounding next round.

Now all my units waited, and they move now. The General moves first and cast Cancellation on the Life Priest that has not moved, while the active Assassin(s) cast Cancellation on the Champions and maybe Fatigue / Sorrow. The three Fireguards pound the Direct Damage on the revealed Life Priest, killing him and perhaps wounding others. If this move reveals the Champions and at least one of my casters can move, I will disable it if I can (Confusion).

One Life Priest down, no losses on my side, the Champion stack disabled and no saving grace from Mass Fervor. AntiMagic won't help either, since without blessings the Champions have no chance against Black Dragons. This battle's not worth continuing. I win.

I therefore deem myself justified in claiming victory. You, however, should note very many things:

1. We are fighting in Equilibris. This is an advantage to you, since I am unfamiliar with it.
2. I am already facing your increased Magic Resistance from Equilibris.
3. I am already facing Cowardice, another feature of Equilibris.
4. I am already facing increased-speed hero stacks, yet another feature of Equilibris.
5. I am already facing Blind, Equilibris again.

I have taken on - and overcome - all these difficulties. How different things would have been if it were pre-Equi!