Best level 1 unit
- Metathron
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Best level 1 unit
Vote for which you think is the best, not your favourite.
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- Grumpy Old Wizard
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I voted stalker due to the overpowered invisibility ability they have.
Frodo: "I wish the ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened."
Gandalf: "So do all who live to see such times but that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."
Gandalf: "So do all who live to see such times but that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."
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Of course, growth and cost are just as important as other factors.danhvo wrote:I want to make it clear, that we're voting based on the same gold cost, right?
Grumpy Old Wizard wrote:I voted stalker due to the overpowered invisibility ability they have.
I think you should also take into consideration how this ability of theirs fares in multiplayer, not merely against AI.wimfrits wrote:Stalkers for their exploitable ability
I also used to think invisibility was overpowered, but I don't anymore, now I just think it is very powerful against the AI/neutral stacks. It happens quite often that your warlock will run out of mana or his spells just won't (yet) have the firepower to destroy the enemy during those 3 turns of invisibility.
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- Grumpy Old Wizard
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Well, almost every battle will be against the AI even in multiplayer.
Having an extremelly powerful level 1 unit gives an extreme advantage in creeping. Each to his own opinion but I objected to any unit having invisibility before TOTE was released. It is just too imbalancing especiallly on a level 1 unit.
Other balance isssues need to be addressed and I am peeved that Ubisoft refuses to communicate with the fans.
TOTE
Having an extremelly powerful level 1 unit gives an extreme advantage in creeping. Each to his own opinion but I objected to any unit having invisibility before TOTE was released. It is just too imbalancing especiallly on a level 1 unit.
Other balance isssues need to be addressed and I am peeved that Ubisoft refuses to communicate with the fans.
TOTE
Frodo: "I wish the ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened."
Gandalf: "So do all who live to see such times but that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."
Gandalf: "So do all who live to see such times but that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."
I'm obviously missing something, because I don't see why people are making such a big deal over invisibility. It only lasts up to 3 turns, doesn't protect stalker from area effect spells, will be dispelled when the stalker attacks or an enemy creature runs into it. Basically, it gives the stalker an ability to make the first attack without retaliation, which is something that a dryad is frequently able to do. And for that, the stalker gives up the ability to shoot. To me, that doesn't even look like an even trade.
- blizzardboy
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If you have Ellaine as a garrison hero, as far as I'm concerned, 2gp earning per day peasants are the best tier 1 unit. With a castle pumping out 50 at the start of the week, that's 100gp a day forever. It doesn't take long before it's like having an extra gold mine. And the longer the game, the more and the more money you make. With Ellaine, it only takes 8 days for peasants to pay for their own cost, then it's all profit from there on. In multi player, when the final battle goes down, I usually upgrade them all into conscripts and put them with my main hero and have them charge wildly into combat like a herd of sheep charging a pack of wolves. But their main purpose is the $$$, which Haven never has enough of.
Unless you're fighting a 30 year old Russian male whose goal in life is to have no life. In which case you lose by default. The best option is to hit the "quit" button on day 1.
Without Ellaine, I'd say stalkers just because they can conduct operation cheese.
Unless you're fighting a 30 year old Russian male whose goal in life is to have no life. In which case you lose by default. The best option is to hit the "quit" button on day 1.
Without Ellaine, I'd say stalkers just because they can conduct operation cheese.
Last edited by blizzardboy on 19 May 2008, 08:29, edited 2 times in total.
Basically, stalkers are used as fodder troops. So only up to 7 stacks of single stalkers are deployed.danhvo wrote:I'm obviously missing something, because I don't see why people are making such a big deal over invisibility. It only lasts up to 3 turns, doesn't protect stalker from area effect spells, will be dispelled when the stalker attacks or an enemy creature runs into it. Basically, it gives the stalker an ability to make the first attack without retaliation, which is something that a dryad is frequently able to do. And for that, the stalker gives up the ability to shoot. To me, that doesn't even look like an even trade.
If there is no target in sight enemy AI stacks will simply wait in those 3 turns, so that means at least 3 extra spell casts for your hero. In most cases, this provides the needed edge to defeat ranged units/casters in early game.
I find the combination with Lethos even more unbalanced, as the waiting of enemies doubles the effect of decay.
Stalkers are also great in combination with the ballista skill. I once cleared an entire map with Deleb and a stack of joining stalkers alone, leaving my Inferno troops going to waste..
And a decent spellcaster hero can survive insane odds in castle defense against AI with 7 stalker only.
Are you suggesting coconuts migrate?
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I think all these creatures can be useful in their own right.
Conscript/Brute, I don't know about, because I'd rather never upgrade that dwelling until the very end, making money off the peasants. But I suppose the unupgraded creature can be factored in as well.
Familiar/Vermin, well I think the Familiar are probably the worst creatures in the list, but the Vermins are actually quite useful to give your Pit Lords some extra mana, which is good especially in combination with a hero that specialises alot in Gating.
Skeleton Archers aren't very good, but you usually get alot of them, and beside the Liches (and if you choose the alternative upgrade for Liches, you'll be using them alot for spellcasting anyway) are the only shooters in the Undead army. Still, I think the Skeleton Warriors are better. They can become the strongest stack in your army..
Sprite/Dryad.. Well, I never much liked the Dryads, as they are usually dead before they can use their ability to heal the Treants, but Sprites are really good. I had a 3x3 duel where at the end of the battle the Guardian Angel ability kicked in and resurrected more than a hundred Sprites from the first hero. Since the enemy hero was out of mana (Sprites don't stand a chance against destructive magic..), I was actually able to win because they managed to outrun the enemy troops enough for my hero to finish them off.
Assassin/Stalker: I always liked the Assassins, with their poison. But I gotta say, nothing beats Stalkers.. For reasons already described
Master Gremlin/Gremlin Saboteur: eh.. Master Gremlins are kinda bad. Even a large group of them doesn't do much damage, and resurrects way too few golems. Maybe they're useful if your first aid tent is destroyed..
Gremlin Saboteurs don't have much use either. That is, until you meet an enemy Sylvan hero with Triple Ballista, Imbue Ballista and Fire Arrows. That's when these guys are incredible Still, they won't survive long enough to sabotage the ballista once, maybe twice.
Shieldguard/Mountainguard: maybe Stalkers have invisibility to keep your hero casting spells 3 more turns, but if you play it right these guys can keep you hanging in there for quite a while as well. Plus it's just great to have a bunch of them in town defense
Goblin Trapper/Goblin Witch Doctor: these are both the best and the worst level 1 unit. Worst, because, well.. I've never actually noticed Defile Magic to work, and those traps maybe once or twice. They can still give a nice hit once you've progressed into melee combat, due to their numbers, but that's it really. Best, because you need them for the Shamans and Cyclopses.
I rather compare in player versus player fights, which means Stalkers aren't going to get my vote
I think I'm gonna go with Vermin. Giving your Pit Lords more mana is really a good ability.
Conscript/Brute, I don't know about, because I'd rather never upgrade that dwelling until the very end, making money off the peasants. But I suppose the unupgraded creature can be factored in as well.
Familiar/Vermin, well I think the Familiar are probably the worst creatures in the list, but the Vermins are actually quite useful to give your Pit Lords some extra mana, which is good especially in combination with a hero that specialises alot in Gating.
Skeleton Archers aren't very good, but you usually get alot of them, and beside the Liches (and if you choose the alternative upgrade for Liches, you'll be using them alot for spellcasting anyway) are the only shooters in the Undead army. Still, I think the Skeleton Warriors are better. They can become the strongest stack in your army..
Sprite/Dryad.. Well, I never much liked the Dryads, as they are usually dead before they can use their ability to heal the Treants, but Sprites are really good. I had a 3x3 duel where at the end of the battle the Guardian Angel ability kicked in and resurrected more than a hundred Sprites from the first hero. Since the enemy hero was out of mana (Sprites don't stand a chance against destructive magic..), I was actually able to win because they managed to outrun the enemy troops enough for my hero to finish them off.
Assassin/Stalker: I always liked the Assassins, with their poison. But I gotta say, nothing beats Stalkers.. For reasons already described
Master Gremlin/Gremlin Saboteur: eh.. Master Gremlins are kinda bad. Even a large group of them doesn't do much damage, and resurrects way too few golems. Maybe they're useful if your first aid tent is destroyed..
Gremlin Saboteurs don't have much use either. That is, until you meet an enemy Sylvan hero with Triple Ballista, Imbue Ballista and Fire Arrows. That's when these guys are incredible Still, they won't survive long enough to sabotage the ballista once, maybe twice.
Shieldguard/Mountainguard: maybe Stalkers have invisibility to keep your hero casting spells 3 more turns, but if you play it right these guys can keep you hanging in there for quite a while as well. Plus it's just great to have a bunch of them in town defense
Goblin Trapper/Goblin Witch Doctor: these are both the best and the worst level 1 unit. Worst, because, well.. I've never actually noticed Defile Magic to work, and those traps maybe once or twice. They can still give a nice hit once you've progressed into melee combat, due to their numbers, but that's it really. Best, because you need them for the Shamans and Cyclopses.
I rather compare in player versus player fights, which means Stalkers aren't going to get my vote
I think I'm gonna go with Vermin. Giving your Pit Lords more mana is really a good ability.
Assassins first, then sprites, then skeletons, then goblins. The reasons are aforementioned.
The other units I don't find much use for them as making me even move them over battlefield, unless, of course, they're the only ones. Usually I keep them guarding shooters.
The other units I don't find much use for them as making me even move them over battlefield, unless, of course, they're the only ones. Usually I keep them guarding shooters.
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I voted Stalkers; I didn't like them personally (too emo), but they are the most powerfull lvl1, both statistically and in-game.
I must add that I think that upgraded Goblins (unupgraded Goblins are the greatest crap in the whole series), Familiars, Skeleton Warriors and Assasins can be extremely dangerous at some times.
Sprites/Dryads and Gremlins are allright, Brutes/Consctripts are total crappy cannon fodder.
Skeleton Archers and Quasits have limited uses, and are likely to be crushed early.
Defenders do what their name says they do, but they only are a real threat in Large numbers, and/or with a very powerfull Runemage (who can cast Expert Implosion or Divine Vengeance for instance)
So most obviously: Stalker.
My personal favourite for this level is the Skeleton Warrior
I must add that I think that upgraded Goblins (unupgraded Goblins are the greatest crap in the whole series), Familiars, Skeleton Warriors and Assasins can be extremely dangerous at some times.
Sprites/Dryads and Gremlins are allright, Brutes/Consctripts are total crappy cannon fodder.
Skeleton Archers and Quasits have limited uses, and are likely to be crushed early.
Defenders do what their name says they do, but they only are a real threat in Large numbers, and/or with a very powerfull Runemage (who can cast Expert Implosion or Divine Vengeance for instance)
So most obviously: Stalker.
My personal favourite for this level is the Skeleton Warrior
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