MM 6 & 7: Does perception help?

[CoffeeGnome]

Hello folks,

Question: How does perception help at all? I know of the one area in MM6 (sewers under Free Haven) where a perception score of rank 3 or better will better help you find the key to the treasure room in the grate, but other than this does this skill actually help you anwhere else in either game? Do I not know how to use it? Does it do anything at all? I seem to be able to find things on my own just as well without it and it does not see to show me anything.

[UndeadHalfOrc]

In MM6 as far as I can tell Perception is only useful to find treasures in skull piles and garbage mounds, maybe skeleton cages too (not sure).

Also, some places in Supreme Temple of Baa are inaccessible unless you have at least Expert Perception.

[HodgePodge]

I find that with Expert Perception, I 'find' things that I didn't see before. Besides, in MM7 & MM8, I like when hidden passages glow red. Very helpful.

[[T]osHiro]

I find that with Expert Perception, I 'find' things that I didn't see before. Besides, in MM7 & MM8, I like when hidden passages glow red. Very helpful.

Everything she said. Not all treasure box are place in front of you in MM, you need to find them, and perception helps.

No perception = gg.

[HodgePodge]

Hello folks,

Question: How does perception help at all? I know of the one area in MM6 (sewers under Free Haven) where a perception score of rank 3 or better will better help you find the key to the treasure room in the grate, but other than this does this skill actually help you anwhere else in either game? Do I not know how to use it? Does it do anything at all? I seem to be able to find things on my own just as well without it and it does not see to show me anything.

You'll need the Perception Skill in order to complete the 'Traitor Quest' before you can gain access to the Oracle of Enroth in Free Haven. After Wilbur Humphries gives you a Cloak of Baa, you'll need to go to the Superior Temple of Baa in Kriegspire to find a cure but what really turns out to be proof of a Traitor on the High Council. Without Perception, some of the doors in the Superior Temple of Baa won't open.

Besides, Perception is really cheap and easy to get. You'll only need one character with it, and with only a Level 4 Skill Points, you can get Expert Perception for only 500 gold. Although, for the Superior Temple of Baa, your character should have at least a 7 in Perception.

[PhoenixReborn]

The higher your perception skill the less damage you take from exploding traps. Of course the character opening the trap has to be the one with perception skill, that's why I usually have them double at disarm trap.

edit: I can't believe such an expert who would write this:

That gives us an idea of how thorough you must be when testing MM7 data. NOT. Please don't even try arguing with me again about MM7 since you're probably too slow to follow what I'm saying and you're really just embarrassing yourself.

would not know about a basic thing like damage reduction from perception.

[UndeadHalfOrc]

I said, "As far as I can tell".
That means I had never personally noticed any damage reduction so I didn't venture and said it.

[CoffeeGnome]

OK perception does turn some areas red in MM7 but it does not in MM6. It would be a much more usefull skill in MM6 if it did. Also I did not notice any damage reduction from traps when I was actually testing this last night?

[HodgePodge]

OK perception does turn some areas red in MM7 but it does not in MM6. It would be a much more usefull skill in MM6 if it did. Also I did not notice any damage reduction from traps when I was actually testing this last night?

I can't say that I noticed any damage reduction either; and you're correct … Perception doesn't turn areas red in MM6 but you'll still need to have it when you're ready to go to the Superior Temple of Baa. If you only have one character with Expert or better Perception, that character should be the one to open the doors.

[PhoenixReborn]

Well I loaded my savegame from Might and Magic 6 to test it out.

It is written right into the description of the perception skill.

Nevertheless, I decided to test it out.

I had two characters with master perception but one of them also had disarm trap.

For testing purposes I used the one without disarm trap. I also used a character who did not have any perception or disarm trap skill.

The character with no skill always was damaged by the trap when she opened losing as many as 30 HP and as few as 15.

The character with perception skill only also lost as many hp as 30 on some occasions when opening the trap. He also went as low as losing only 3 hp, and some times lost none.

So having perception gives a chance to completely avoid damage and also can reduce the damage output. There is also a chance you will take maximum damage.

I haven't tested it in mm7, perhaps it changed?

Edit: I'm also using mok's patch for both games, if that makes a difference.

[CoffeeGnome]

My character has expert (4 ranks) in preception when I was testing the perception skill. I was testing the skill with one of the two chests in the MM7, retrieve my signant-ring from the rogues' hidout quest. All I know is after the 4 times I tested this, the character with the preception skill was not the one that was still standing after opening the chest on 2 occasions. Both times that the chest left only 1 standing it was the cleric character with the highest luck score. The other two times only one character was knocked out (druid) but the character with the preception seemed to have taken just as much damage as the rest of them.
I am not trying to argue, but the results of my test suggest that luck works better at avoiding damage than perception.

[PhoenixReborn]

All I know is after the 4 times I tested this, the character with the preception skill was not the one that was still standing after opening the chest on 2 occasions.

For it to work, the character possessing the perception skill must be the one opening the chest.

[darknessfood]

I'd say it's pretty usefull, espacialy in MM7. There when you spot things in a dungeon the stuff wil go red. In MM6 youll need it in the supreme temple of baa in order to open doors ( at least expert skill 7 ) without that youre screwed! And when your disarm skill isn't that high you will avoid damage taken from the traps...

[CoffeeGnome]

Thank you Pheonix for answering my inquiry. I'll try your suggestion next week when I have the chance. You have more than answered this question for me and I thank you for your input.

[Angelspit]

[you'll still need to have it when you're ready to go to the Superior Temple of Baa.

Just out of curiosity, ss 'Superior' a term related to the Might and Magic only or do we see it in other RPGs? The only other game I saw that term was Dark Messiah, with the Superior Naga Silksword.

[dcinroc]

My memory is a bit hazy, but I seem to recall that there are hidden doors in MM7 that require at least Master perception to see.

Also, most of the hidden doors in the game require at least Expert level.

Keep in mind that since most of us have playedd the games umpteen million times...we know what we are looking for. I can't even remember the last time I was "surprised" by a secret door.

[dcinroc]

For it to work, the character possessing the perception skill must be the one opening the chest.

I don't believe that is true.I had a recent playthrough where my Archer failed to open a chest. He and 2 other characters took varying points of damage, but my cleric dodged the effect completely (bobbing head animation).

As far as I have noticed, you can only escape trap damage with a sufficient perception skill.

[Macros the Black]

I know this an old thread, but I didn't see this mentioned yet: in MM6, the Perception skill is also required to pick up crystals, like the ones you can find in Snergle's Ironfist dungeon. Some crystals will say "useless crystal" when clicked on. These aren't lootable, and really are useless. Other crystals (depending on your selected character's perception skill) will either be picked up or don't do anything (not even give a message). So if a crystal doesn't give a message and you can't pick it up, it means your perception skill isn't high enough or you don't have the right character selected.

Also, as mentioned, it helps for skull piles and trash heaps but those never drop anything worthwhile. And lastly, it's required for the doors in the superior temple of baa (normal 4 is good enough except for one which requires master 8 and can be bypassed).

EDIT: I could see things like the chance to find a ring in a cookpot or whether or not a gold vein collapses be tied to Perception or Luck, but they really just seem to be random as far as I can tell.

[Bandobras Took]

For it to work, the character possessing the perception skill must be the one opening the chest.

I don't believe that is true.I had a recent playthrough where my Archer failed to open a chest. He and 2 other characters took varying points of damage, but my cleric dodged the effect completely (bobbing head animation).

As far as I have noticed, you can only escape trap damage with a sufficient perception skill.

This is correct. Perception gives you a chance to completely dodge the damage from a trapped chest. If you fail the roll, you take the damage.

[xenon23]

I have never found the benefits of perception to outweigh the benefits of putting those skillpoints elsewhere. I only put the minimum neccessary to progress the plot and not a point more. Other than that, it is quite simply, not needed.