What type of map(story-wise) do you prefer?

[Corribus]

Funny... the life campaign was one of the only ones I liked.

[theLuckyDragon]

Everything is possible...

Except the impossible.

Even that is possible. That's the beauty of this saying: it's a paradox.

[Wildbear]

Then maybe you just haven't yet played a good story-driven strategic map.

Maybe, I probably didn't play more than a dozen, I'm really not interested in following the arrows anyway.

it can't be defined as exclusively TBS or anything

It can't as a whole but many maps taken separately can easily fit in a category or another. It's all about the ratio between strategy and role playing in this case.

[theLuckyDragon]

it can't be defined as exclusively TBS or anything

It can't as a whole but many maps taken separately can easily fit in a category or another. It's all about the ratio between strategy and role playing in this case.

Exactly. And all of these maps are played in the same game, which proves its versatility, by the way.

[DaemianLucifer]

A linear hack and slash,or a completely opened story driven map?

That's completely wrong, most "hack&slash" maps aren't linear when story-driven maps usually are.

First,welcome back,we missed you

Second I made two random choces.And there are story driven maps that are non-linear:trapped inside the beast,the wind of thorns,arround the calendar,saga of depieleres,the rife campaigns,etc.You really should try them.

And it is not true that there are no stories behind strategies.Sime are pretty detailed.Look at starcraft for example(I wanted to say warcraft or C&C,but starcraft is without expansions,so you could say that the story behind it is much more impresive).Or the homeworld.Stories can be found even in shooters(HL,thief,deus ex,...).Its not that stories are exlusively tied to RPG genre.

[Wildbear]

The question is not about the game, it's about the maps.

@DaemianLucifer
I came back weeks ago

The question is not if it has a story or not, but if it is story-driven. You can have a story and multiple choices. This happens a lot in RPGs, much less in Heroes maps.

[Crusard]

The question is not about the game, it's about the maps.

Yeah, exactly when did this topic deviate...?

Anyway, I think any H4 scenario has definetely RPG objects in it. The concept of RPG doesn't necesarily involve story, it's just about growing up and getting rich, in a way.

In my opinion, H4 is clearly the most "RPGised" game of the series. I even made a RPG campaign

[DaemianLucifer]

@DaemianLucifer
I came back weeks ago

But you posted very inactively.

The question is not if it has a story or not, but if it is story-driven. You can have a story and multiple choices. This happens a lot in RPGs, much less in Heroes maps.

Play any of the maps/campaigns I suggested and youll see its not that rare as you think.

[Veldrynus]

I like RPGs a lot, but one thing that is often missing from RPGs is a good strategic element. Heroes offers both, which is why I like it so much.

Strategy means making long term decisions. Unfortunately, you don't have to make such decisions in any of the Homm games. It is more a tactical game. In fact RPGs have lots of tactical elements too, espcially the battles.

[DaemianLucifer]

Strategy means making long term decisions. Unfortunately, you don't have to make such decisions in any of the Homm games. It is more a tactical game. In fact RPGs have lots of tactical elements too, espcially the battles.

Well,with choosable dwelings it did tend to be more strategic,but lets not talk about that cursed part anymore.

[Veldrynus]

Well,with choosable dwelings it did tend to be more strategic,but lets not talk about that cursed part anymore.

It was a screwed part, not a cursed one.

[DaemianLucifer]

Thats not the stance devs took.It looks like they wont touch it even wearing bio hazard suits,and using tele-guided robots from a mile away.

[Crusard]

To get back on topic again...

I was just playing a campaign I had stored in my Map folder for a while. And it made me think about the stories in maps...
What makes a story interesting is the fact that it does indeed correspond to that particular scenario. Everything said in the text should have important effect on the gameplay. In some maps, you could just skip all the text and get a score higher than the map maker's. If I wanted to read a story that doesn't interact with the gameplay then I'd just read a book instead.

My point is, if the story doesn't need to be read, then it doesn't deserve to be read.

[Metathron]

One of the best example is my favorite map in the whole Heroes serie: Broken Alliance. Not story driven, several strategies possible, a virtually infinite replay value. That's the kind of map I like to play in a strategy game.

I'm glad there's a fellow BA enthusiast out there. And I couldn't agree more!

[Wildbear]

I made some kind of remake of it for H4. I added side quests for the rpg lovers but as said, those are side quests, which means you can disregard them completely. There is a mistake in the title due to wrong translation, I named it "back to the ring" thinking the english title of the original was "the ring".

Whatever, back to the topic, I had something to add: There's one reason why I usually don't like story driven maps: in almost all of them either the story doesn't fit with the castle you choose or it is not allowed to choose you castle and your opponents. If all castle types are static on a map, it always has a similar gameplay, no matter how many times you play it.

Of course a mapmaker could write a different story-line for every alignment, but not a lot of them would do, and they wouldn't do it everytime on a large amount of maps. IMO that's a huge limit for story-driven maps.

[Corribus]

Of course a mapmaker could write a different story-line for every alignment, but not a lot of them would do, and they wouldn't do it everytime on a large amount of maps. IMO that's a huge limit for story-driven maps.

Unfortunately, you are correct. It's nearly impossible to create a story map that allows the player to pick his/her own alignment (and still make sense). But I think most people who specifically enjoy story maps don't really care that much about that. Of course I could be wrong.

[ByteBandit]

This unnamed mapmaker voted for the 3rd choice. I do like to have some sort of story, but I concentrate heavily on the strategic part of the game. keeping in mind the story at hand. But some of you may be like me and play maps from all over the world where story sometimes just cannot be interpreted.

[Gaidal Cain]

Of course a mapmaker could write a different story-line for every alignment, but not a lot of them would do, and they wouldn't do it everytime on a large amount of maps. IMO that's a huge limit for story-driven maps.

On the other hand, the more fixed a map becomes, the more interesting it is in SP, because tuning the AI becomes easier. The game varies from a focus on tactics to a focus on strategy. The less important strategy becomes, the easier it is to make it a good story map. That doesn't mean that story maps can't be interesting strategically, it just means it's very difficult.

[DaemianLucifer]

Whatever, back to the topic, I had something to add: There's one reason why I usually don't like story driven maps: in almost all of them either the story doesn't fit with the castle you choose or it is not allowed to choose you castle and your opponents. If all castle types are static on a map, it always has a similar gameplay, no matter how many times you play it.

Of course a mapmaker could write a different story-line for every alignment, but not a lot of them would do, and they wouldn't do it everytime on a large amount of maps. IMO that's a huge limit for story-driven maps.

I seem to remember that there was a map like that.It had a different story depending on which race you picked.But I might be wrong.And again Ill mention wind of thorns where you have two completely different stories.

[Thelonious]

@DaemianLucifer
I came back weeks ago

Yep, it's the real Wildbear allright.

The question is not if it has a story or not, but if it is story-driven. You can have a story and multiple choices. This happens a lot in RPGs, much less in Heroes maps.

Well mapmakers do try and give people choices as of how to solve quests and the like...