Tribes of the East Previews

[Moragauth]

"I don't see how "coherent magical theory" is a requirment. Sure, it's nice, but since Ubival doesn't seem to wish to go deeper into that respect (which NWC didn't either!), I don't see the problem."



Fine, you don't, I do. Nival can always remain second-rate as far as lore is concerned.



"I can repeat only that you have to consider the fact that all those 4 Shatter Magic skill PLUS one of the racial abilities that will decrease enemy spell power depending on the Orc hero's own will be of NO use whatsoever in the normal course of the game - (with the exception of Shatter Destructive against a maximum of 7 different creatures)."



Do these abilities do anything beyond diminishing spellpower? If not, they shouldn't be too much of a problem for either Dungeon or Necropolis.
Edited on Thu, Aug 02 2007, 06:38 by Moragauth

[Wraith]

well i Quess the warlocks magic will be effective against orcs.The warlocks irrestible magic will broke those magic blocks,as magic resistance.
Edited on Thu, Aug 02 2007, 09:12 by Wraith

[Jolly Joker]

THE ORCS DON'T HAVE ANY MAGIC RESISTANCE!!!

@Moragauth
One of the three racial skill abilities will decrease opponent's spell power depending on the Orc hero's own spell power (I guess it's simply subtracted for effective power).
The 3 abilities for the 4 Shatter Magic skills are doing something else, but they have the same effect, so the skill/ability sets for those are equal.

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

well i Quess the wizards magic will be effective against orcs.The wizards irrestible magic will broke those magic blocks,as magic resistance.

You are thinking of warlocks, they are the ones with irrestible magic.

The wizards have a low spell power already so any reduction reduction in spell power by shatter will have a big impact on their magic. Evidently shatter works on creature magic too so the Archmage can't hide and cast effective fireballs when threatened. I'm guessing shatter is a passive ability so he doesn't have to waste a turn like the wizard does with counterspell.

I wonder if the warcries can be dispelled or countered since they are not called spells?

I hope they let us see the orc ability tree soon.

GOW

[PhoenixReborn]

@ GOW:

You may perceive the academy as woefully underpowered but I can tell you everytime I go online to play a game my opponent picks wizard or warlock (unless I convince them to go all random). This is the reality. IMO the way gating works needs more of a look right now than anything else.

I wouldn't mind a spellpower boost for the wizards though, perhaps the points could be distributed less toward knowledge and more towards spellpower.

[Jolly Joker]

War Cries cost Mana, but are more something like abilities that have to be activated. With one exception, I think, they are all one-turn wonders, though.

[Wurtzel]

Makes me wonder what their (the orcs) ultimate is.... Maybe complete magical immunity?? Or perhaps permenant battle rage...

[Moragauth]

Thanks for the info JJ. I am hopeful that Nival will balance this well. I wish they'd rework the spellcaster skills to deal with anti-magic abilities, like Dungeon does with its irresistible magic. Since I am into spellcasters, anti-magic usually irritates me, unless it can be dealt with.
Edited on Thu, Aug 02 2007, 17:59 by Moragauth

[Jolly Joker]

About Anti-Magic, it's a spell I personally never liked - it's an illogical, over-powered spell, and I don't see what it does in the Light Magic department. What I'd have conceded better would have been a Ward spell for Light (against Dark) and for Summoning (against Destructive), that would work against one spell (with Power checks) with an area capability.
The same is true for Teleport which belongs to Summoning as well, imo.

[Wraith]

You are thinking of warlocks, they are the ones with irrestible magic.





yeah warlocks,i wrote first time wrong.
Edited on Fri, Aug 03 2007, 03:57 by Wraith

[Wraith]

Jolly Joker at 2007-08-02 09:17 wrote:

THE ORCS DON'T HAVE ANY MAGIC RESISTANCE!!!



yeah, i know,but i believe the irrestible magic will broke those magic blocks.

[Moragauth]

Wraith, that would be lovely, but Irresistible Magic deals specifically with spell resistance. It would be nice if it weakened Shatter magic though.



JJ, it isn't the only spell of that kind. Deflect Missile is also overpowered IMO. If it decreased ranged damage by 50% I'd understand, but the amount it decreases at expert is ridiculous. I agree with your idea.
Edited on Fri, Aug 03 2007, 06:35 by Moragauth

[Jolly Joker]

Yeah. Deflect Missile is one hell of a powerful spell, especially on Expert - but so are the other mass spells. I mean, plus 40% Initiative for all your creatures (or -40%) kills as well.
I'm not sure that's wrong though - I mean, if you are blasted by some lucky empowered Meteor Shower those mass spells are of not much use, not to mention the fact that Dungeon has no ranged power to speak of.

[rdeford]

@ GOW -- I hope they let us see the orc ability tree soon.



Indeed! Without it, we speculate too much.



Also, I agree with you on the desirability of traditional fantasy races and abilities. Without them, the burden of creating an immersing, approachable game setting is too great for the developer. Since most developers are better at coding than storytelling, we end up with nonsense like tree-hugging orcs that feed the land with blood to protect mother nature.

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

Also, I agree with you on the desirability of traditional fantasy races and abilities. Without them, the burden of creating an immersing, approachable game setting is too great for the developer. Since most developers are better at coding than storytelling, we end up with nonsense like tree-hugging orcs that feed the land with blood to protect mother nature.

Yeah, I thought the Sylvans were supposed to be the tree huggers in the game. Now orcs are protecting mother nature from the elves?

GOW

[Moragauth]

JJ, it wouldn't be so devastating if ranged units did full damage across the battlefield - it effectively means they only do 30% of half their full damage, rendering them a mere nuissance. Even if it were set at 50% on expert it'd be bad enough. Anyway, I didn't mention it with relation to Dungeon; the faction is mostly melee-oriented anyway.

[ThunderTitan]

>we end up with nonsense like tree-hugging orcs that feed the land with blood to protect mother nature.<

How is that not COOL in any way?! Nature demands blood... no matter what hippies think.

[Jolly Joker]

While I can understand your point I don't share it. You have to see the spell within the frame of the whole game.
First thing is, to get the spell to that effect you must invest 3 of your 18 skill levels and 1 of your 18 abilities plus it must be "activated" (as opposed to what you get with attack, for example). Furthermore there aren't so many spells and it is a level 3 spell.
The spell effect on expert effectively kills ranged power, at least on higher range - and this is exactly what it ahould do, because think of who is affected. To make matters short, I think that Dungeon, Inferno and the Orcs are no race to cast that spell against and even Nekropolis isn't one. Against Fortress you won't cast it as well, which leaves, Haven, Sylvans and Academy - who, incidentally will all be able to get that spell. So if THEY fight against each other, for example Haven against Sylvan, it's an interesting tactical decision. Haven might cast it to guard their charging high level troops against the Elves, but Mass Endurance wouldn't be such a bad counter (and you can clearly turn that around with not much difference).
I think, that Mass Confusion is at least as good, but it gets interesting for the no-light-magic races in case they don't get Confusion in the guild, but Endurance and Deflect Missile. Imagine those 2 spells in the Necro guild, for example, and it may indeed be worth it to acquire Light Magic and Master of abjuration.
Lastly, the spell isn't a no-brainer to cast in any normal battle situation (except if it's your only mass spell and you face a ton of shooters), so all in all it looks right to me.