Changes to make Heroes 5 buyable

[jeff]

Okay, by being brief I implied that low level units should be impotent and near worthless, and nothing could be farther from the truth. Many games give special abilities to the weaker unit, even in the board game Stratego the most powerful unit (the Marshall) could be taken only by the weakest (the spy). I was commenting more the silly restrictions of large unit placements forced by a small battlefield. If a player wants to divide a stack of large creatures (with several in it) into several smaller (in number of creatures) stacks up to the maximum number of allowed stacks, then why should the battlefield size limit this. In all previous versions we have been limited by the number of stacks, reasonable, but not by the space the units would take.

[Gaidal Cain]

In all previous versions we have been limited by the number of stacks, reasonable, but not by the space the units would take.

Actually, the stack limit Could easily be seen as the more superficial of these. After all, why shouldn't a general be able to split off one extra centaur stack if he wished, despite having dwarves, elves, pegasi, dendsroids, unicorns and dragons with him? Having to restrict yourself due to no physical space is at least a bit more "realistic". The problem is of course that this one of the more abstract parts of the game, so any limit can be seen as illogical if one wishes.

[DaemianLucifer]

In all previous versions we have been limited by the number of stacks, reasonable, but not by the space the units would take.

Actually, the stack limit Could easily be seen as the more superficial of these. After all, why shouldn't a general be able to split off one extra centaur stack if he wished, despite having dwarves, elves, pegasi, dendsroids, unicorns and dragons with him? Having to restrict yourself due to no physical space is at least a bit more "realistic". The problem is of course that this one of the more abstract parts of the game, so any limit can be seen as illogical if one wishes.

Well any limit is illogical.Thats why my favourite strategy is civ.It has no limits,both in space and in unit amount.

[Gaidal Cain]

Of course, but with the HoMM battlefield, there has to be a limit. Both players bringing in 50 units on the current BF would mean that all couldn't fit in. If you wish to try a fantasy TBS that works similarly to civ, you should try Wesnoth.

[DaemianLucifer]

Of course, but with the HoMM battlefield, there has to be a limit. Both players bringing in 50 units on the current BF would mean that all couldn't fit in. If you wish to try a fantasy TBS that works similarly to civ, you should try Wesnoth.

Actually I did try it.And I find its gameplay superior to heroes in a lot of ways.

[Anonymous]

[ Having to restrict yourself due to no physical space is at least a bit more "realistic". The problem is of course that this one of the more abstract parts of the game, so any limit can be seen as illogical if one wishes.

I would agree with that if the limit was the terrain of the battlefield prevented bringing your whole army on the board (terrain too mountainous or the river too deep), then you would try to chose your place of battle when possible. My grip here is this is a limitation throughout the adventure map and brought on by a seemingly capricious decision. I maybe wrong but I think but most us were looking for a more expansive experience at least that equal to the earlier versions. Having said that I have not had the time to even play the beta and I shy away from multiplayer anyway, so most of my comments are a reaction to comments of those the forum participants.

[arthureloi]

Damn, man! Everywhere I go, I see someone saying civ is a good game... The reviews, the players.. all the same! Are you paid to say so, dudes??? I played civ IV, and man that was crappy all the way, I understood the game, but it´s so full of fancy frills, you need more patience than playinh Heroes IV with other 4 players.. Bah, I´d rather play king´s bounty than this civ everyone talks about, what a friggin faggy game eh? Sorry for this offtopic, men.

[theLuckyDragon]

Damn, man! Everywhere I go, I see someone saying civ is a good game... The reviews, the players.. all the same! Are you paid to say so, dudes??? I played civ IV, and man that was crappy all the way, I understood the game, but it´s so full of fancy frills, you need more patience than playinh Heroes IV with other 4 players.. Bah, I´d rather play king´s bounty than this civ everyone talks about, what a friggin faggy game eh? Sorry for this offtopic, men.

We are most certainly not paid. And if you don't have the patience to play the game, then you shouldn't start calling other people's preferences "friggin faggy", whatever that means.

[arthureloi]

Friggin faggy stands for gayish, but that would be bad in this forum, so better not say it.
I didn´t call your preferences faggy, friend. I called the game faggy, because it is. Lasted less than a week in my PC and I cursed me for having bought it. Rather play age of empires II. Games should be complex, for men, avoiding the fancy frills, just like Baldur´s gate, morrowind, heroes, diablo.... this civ gets on my nerves, 50 bucks thrown away...

[ThunderTitan]

Games should be complex, for men, avoiding the fancy frills, just like Baldur´s gate, morrowind, heroes, diablo.... this civ gets on my nerves, 50 bucks thrown away...

Diablo complex?

So did Civ dress womanly or something?

[DaemianLucifer]

Friggin faggy stands for gayish, but that would be bad in this forum, so better not say it.
I didn´t call your preferences faggy, friend. I called the game faggy, because it is. Lasted less than a week in my PC and I cursed me for having bought it. Rather play age of empires II. Games should be complex, for men, avoiding the fancy frills, just like Baldur´s gate, morrowind, heroes, diablo.... this civ gets on my nerves, 50 bucks thrown away...

Just because you dont like something,dont bash it.And civ is far more complex than heroes will ever be.Plus in 4th part they managed something that I thought imposible:they made it more complex than any of the previous parts(which was to be expected),yet they made it extremely easy for a begginer to play.

[arthureloi]

Well, first - Man, after you read the 3 novels: Diablo: legacy of blood, Diablo - the black road and Diablo - the kingdom of shadows, it does, in fact, get much deeper than you can fathom.
Second - I´m not bashing. As much as you have the right to like it and express it, I have the right of thinking it sucks and say it, too.
Third - It indeed is gayish, more deeply than if it featured womanly dressing.
Fourth - Thanks god when I was a child I didn´t play any of the civs, now I´m 18 and played Civ IV, and regret it. Bad graphics, nonsense logic, horrible combat, fancy features like "oh, man We´ve got pollution", now that looks much more like sim city to me, another game I abominate. Now try legacy of kain, baldur´s gate, morrowind, neverwinter nights, and quality games like these. I assure you that despite morrowind, not one of these is largely known for its name. Civ is just a name, and me and my brother contested it 2 months ago. Divine Divinity is a good call, too if you are a really gamer and want complexity, not frills.

[RK]

lol @ the above poster.

morrowind is 25% hmm tis is big...and...lots of....stuff.....75% ......ok...i'm bored what the hell am i supposed to do now. i'm not really ecstatic about oblivion, their focus seemed to go too much on graphics instead of gameplay. fix the swordplay dammit. i get bored of having 3 types of swings over n over.

baldur's gate 2 is decent. i just bought the game again and so happy that it worked it's so much better than recent rpgs.

i admit i played civ 4 like crazy when it came out but crave for a more detailed combat like h4. civ4 lived up to the hype for those who slammed it hard it's just not ur cup of tea, i guess.

[Zombie]

Confusing 3D interface and the necessity (not option) to rotate the camera to get about.

I haven't tried the beta but if this indeed proves to be the case, it will be enough for me not to buy the game. I hate 3D.

And as for arthureloi... So you're 18, you're a big man now eh? Come back when you're old enough to get over your homophobia. Civ 4 is 10 times the game HoMM5 could ever claim to be.

[Gaidal Cain]

Third - It indeed is gayish, more deeply than if it featured womanly dressing.

Mod Note: Unless you wish to be hit hard by Kalah's Cricket Bat, I suggest you find a more eloquent way of expressing the suckyness of different kinds of things than suggesting that they're male homosexuals, which not only are irrelevant, but also is potentially hurtful to other Round Tablers. You don't know who is reading these boards.

[DaemianLucifer]

@arthureloi

Saying that a game sucks and saying that a game is gay are two completely different things.Stop it,seriously.

Baldurs gate is excelent,but it cannot be compared with civ since those are two completely different games.Same goes for morrowind.And NWN just lacks some elements in order to be trully great.

And saying that bg isnt known?Where are you living?

Bad graphics in civ?You really need your eyes checked.Nonsense logic?Same goes for your brain.

[Infiltrator]

I myself played civ 3 and 4 a bit, but just couldn't find myself in that game. Heroes is by far more enjoyable to me, which doesn't mean I think civ 'sucks', quite the opposite. I see why people love it, but it's not what I consider fun. All those titles arthureloi mentioned (except nwn imo) are legendary and I REALLY doubt people are less familiar with them.

[omegaweix]

Third - It indeed is gayish, more deeply than if it featured womanly dressing.

Mod Note: Unless you wish to be hit hard by Kalah's Cricket Bat, I suggest you find a more eloquent way of expressing the suckyness of different kinds of things than suggesting that they're male homosexuals, which not only are irrelevant, but also is potentially hurtful to other Round Tablers. You don't know who is reading these boards.

I totally agree.... everyone has to mind his/her bl***y language!

And a computer game can hardly be gay... because of it's blatant lack of sexuality!

BTW, the Round Tables are one of the few message boards, where moderators actually pay attention to a certain level of piety...
...many other boards have become virtually unreadable because they were constantly plastered with pre-pubertal feculence!

Thanks for that, venerated HRT mods!

[Suleman]

How about going back to the subject, eh? I'm all for discussing Civ 4, but not here.

I am somewhat disappointed with the uniformity of the towns at the moment: 3 big units for all towns (Liches and Genies? Why?), no Might town and no super-special strategies for e.g. Dungeon. No town-aligned magic schools, either.

Is this just because I'm a fortress player? I've always had a liking for unique factions, all the way from the Zerg in Starcraft to the Goths in Age of Kings to Fortress in Heroes 3.
WHERE IS MY SUPER-SPECIAL TOWN, DAMMIT!?

That's all.

[DaemianLucifer]

Ah,but having a special town would disturb the delicate balance we have now.Its much better to copy one town and tweak it a bit,then to come up with a completely new one.