alternative upgrade speculation

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

@ GOW
No, I disagree. People are complaining about the map editor anyway and we won't see an abundance of maps, it seems; it makes no sense to waste effort there. If the balance with the new upgrades is sound it will work. If not, it will be a nightmare anyway.
You don't really expect different BUILDINGS for them , do you? 56 additional graphic Elements which have to be included in the town view and stuff? Never. They'll have work enough to do with all those cinematics for the new units.

I have no faith that Nival will balance all the upgrades. The factions are not balanced as it is so I have no reason to believe that with all the new units the factions will suddenly be balanced.

The more options the mapmaker has the better maps he can make. It is the mapmakers who are responsible for the success of the series too be quite blunt. They keep fresh content coming in, keeping interest in the game long after the game would have died without them and the best maps have always been maps produced by fans.

I don't care if there are different graphics for the new buildings or not. Just make them produce only one version of the upgrade. And give the mapmaker the power to build buildings via scripting so they can force the computer to use effective combinations of troops.

GOW

[Jolly Joker]

It makes no sense: if the game is well playable only if and when mapmakers include scripts, it's not worth the while anyway because then you would get only a handful of decent maps to play.
No, things must be ok without special scripts.

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

It makes no sense: if the game is well playable only if and when mapmakers include scripts, it's not worth the while anyway because then you would get only a handful of decent maps to play.
No, things must be ok without special scripts.

Yes, that would be nice. Let's say tha Nival suprises me and every faction is completely balanced with every possible combination of normal upgrades and alternate upgrades. It would still be nice for the mapmaker to be able to script the building of specific buildings at specific times.

This would for example be used:
1) As a quest reward.
2) To make the computer use only certain combinations of troops (for example only renegades) for story purposes.
3) Lots of other creative reasons that mapmakers come up with.

GOW

[Apocalypse]

I agree completely with GOW. The more options the map maker has, the better the maps and the game

[Jolly Joker]

I'm sure there are enough ways to make the AI have only one type of upgrade, whether there are different buildings or not. You could make the dwelling impossible to build (for the AI) and instead make the wsihed for upgrades available per event each weak, for example.

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

I'm sure there are enough ways to make the AI have only one type of upgrade, whether there are different buildings or not. You could make the dwelling impossible to build (for the AI) and instead make the wsihed for upgrades available per event each weak, for example.

Yes indeed that can be done and I had to give troops in such a way in my Seize The Throne map for a boost for the first few weeks of the game because the AI does not build optimally and there is no way to script the building of a particular building in the editor.

However, it would be easier and less time consuming for a mapmaker not to have to write all that code and troubleshoot all that code if he could use a single line of for a building and be done with it. Plus all that code has to run every week instead of one time per building.

Of course if both upgrade types are available from a single building and the AI captures a town that the player has built up all bets are off and the AI may wind of with 2 stacks fo each upgraded lower level troops and no room for the higher level troops.

GOW

[Mytical]

The 'nicer' inferno upgrades.

Bonded- These creatures are able to either absorb damage from another friendly creature, or feed some of it to an enemy stack. If they are 'backfeeding' the damage for each 10 of their number (rounded up to nearest 10) the damage they take is reduced by 1 and that ammount of damage is returned to their attacker. They can also choose to take the damage meant for another friendly stack (targetted on their turn). No backfeeding of damage is possible if they choose this.

Forsaken Demon - These creatures have all but been cast out. Since they do not value their own life they can 'sacrifice' themselves. The entire stack is destroyed but the normal damage they would do is added to the total ammount of hp they have and dealt to a target creature as if that creature had 0 defense.

Hunt Hounds - The hounds that partake in 'the Great hunt' for lost or runaway souls. In combat they have the ability to 'select' an enemy stack at the beginning of combat. They then do 1.5x their normal damage to that stack, but only 75% damage to the other enemy stacks. They also get two attacks, but not no -retal or muti square hit.

Alurbus - Some Succubi become so alluring and dangerous they morph into the Alurbus. They not only have ranged retal, 2 ranged attacks (they do not chain attack however), but there is a small percentage that any creature hit by them is overcome with a wish to protect the Alurbus. The victims of this will (if near the Alurbus) intercept any attack (melee or ranged) aimed at the Alurbus. If not close enough, they will frenzy and attack the creature that attacked the Alurbus. (If they do no reach the attacking unit within a round they snap out of it, and if they are hit likewise).

(TBC)

[Orfinn]

How can you upgrade an elf to a faceless?

And why always renegades?

Saphire Dragon - (Air blast attack that does damage and moves enemy units back 1 square).

But cant attack two stacks in a row

[Ar.Pi]

"Magma Dragon - Godzilla" all the way!!!

[ThunderTitan]

"Flaming Godzilla" dude.

[watcher83]

bear rider - blackbear rider - polar bear rider

[Orfinn]

or grizzlybear rider

[Omega_Destroyer]

Kodiak rider would be cool, but Polar Bear rider seems to be the most logical. Give them a %50 resistance to cold or something like that.

[BlackBeast]

Zombie -> Ghoul (+speed)
Demon -> Magog (Fireball instead of explosion)
Green Dragon -> Fairy Dragon (spells)
Scout -> Rogue (no poison, higher stats)

[Orfinn]

Zombie -> Ghoul (+speed)
Demon -> Magog (Fireball instead of explosion)
Green Dragon -> Fairy Dragon (spells)
Scout -> Rogue (no poison, higher stats)

Nice proposal and welcome to the boards, enjoy your stay

but dude, its faerie not fairy unless you refer to the small winged creatures, smaller than a flower in the fairytales from childhood

[BlackBeast]

but dude, its faerie not fairy unless you refer to the small winged creatures, smaller than a flower in the fairytales from childhood

sorry for mistake I meant faerie
Anyway this one in HIII looked like a fairy

P.S Maybe Shadow Dragon -> FEARie Dragon

[okrane]

scary big dragon

[BlackBeast]

what do you think about green -> fire extinguisher dragon?
It would do more damage on dragons (dungeon, fortress), elementals and infernal creatures.

[okrane]

it should come with a fire hose or smth...

[BlackBeast]

Maybe third new faction shoul be Fire-Fighters faction
Gnomes with Buckets on 1st level