Elder Scrolls: Oblivion

[Ethric]

There's no doubt in my mind that Morrowind is far better than Oblivion out of the package. But hopefully the OOO's changes to the horrible level-based stuff will make it more enjoyable. And from what I read, OOO adds underwater life as well.

[arturchix]

Well, I have one of the latest OOO versions if not the latest and I haven't noticed any underwater life at all (BTW, I happen to have the Tamriel Rebuilt underwater mod for Morrowind). Maybe I just haven't spend enough time underwater but that's because there's nothing to do and there are almost no quests involved. I guess asking for an underwater town a la underwater town from SW Episode 1 is just too much.

[PhoenixReborn]

BTW, after spending about 100 hours in Oblivion and 200 in Morrowind, comparing the both games I tend to think that Morrowind is still better. I mean, Oblivion has no underwater life, no flying creatures, almost no snow, problems to level up, leveled items etc.

The additional content Bethesda is providing is simply pathetic - not that it's bad but they are such minor and unimportant things and they were doing this for free when Morrowind was released. And later Bethesda developed two expansions and it doesn't look like Oblivion will have any.

Morrowind had two underwater creatures and some 'hidden' stuff so it wins underwater. Morrowind had one flying creature generally considered an annoyance. I don't remember any snow in Morrowind, do you mean that Oblivion should have more?

I have no problem with the leveling up system, the basics are the same as morrowind (albeit fewer skills sucks) and the leveled loot system is the same as daggerfall and arena. It wasn't a problem for me then and it isn't now.

I'm trying to find out about this extra content like Knights of the nine. As you say it seems quite poor.

But let me tell you man Morrowind out of the box was not a pretty sight. I've had far fewer problems with Oblivion technically. Reviews of the original game point to it being very difficult for modern systems of the time to run without severe choppiness...there's also tons of bugs still that are fixed by the uomp. Even basic things like knowing how much health the enemy had were not in Morrowind 1.0.

[arturchix]

Morrowind had two underwater creatures and some 'hidden' stuff so it wins underwater. Morrowind had one flying creature generally considered an annoyance. I don't remember any snow in Morrowind, do you mean that Oblivion should have more?

I should have said that I'm talking about the whole Morrowind world (Game of the Year edition that includes Tribunal and Bloodmoon) and not single Morrowind edition - I usually call Morrowind GotY simply Morrowind, my fault. Island Soltsheim is basically one giant snow rock, so yes - there is snow in Morrowind. While Morrowind waters are heavily populated by slaughterfish, sometimes with dreughs, coasts are crammed with crabs, what do we have in Oblivion, eh? Few mudcrabs in coasts at best and several non-aggressive slaughterfish in caves. And I certainly think it's better to have annoying cliff racers rather than not having any flying monsters at all. Yep, Oblivion certainly should have more.

I have no problem with the leveling up system, the basics are the same as morrowind (albeit fewer skills sucks) and the leveled loot system is the same as daggerfall and arena. It wasn't a problem for me then and it isn't now.

Sure, neither do I but I know some players who have and it's another step to reduce freedom on actions the player can do - funnily enough that freedom on actions is one of the main mottos of the Elder Scrolls series. It makes absolutely no sense that I have to reach certain level to get certain items and certain monsters - let the player travel to off-world, if necessary to get what player wants even if early on but don't make such limitations. Limiting 5 training sessions from trainers per level makes no sense as well - this was purely done to avoid fast level ups.

I'm trying to find out about this extra content like Knights of the nine. As you say it seems quite poor.

I did not say they are bad - just not enough comparing with the additional content original Morrowind was provided. But maybe the best stuff is to come.

[PhoenixReborn]

Apologies Arturchix I forgot about the expansions because I haven't gotten there yet. I've spent most of my time in the original game over the several years I've had it.

The training thing is all right since I only rarely use it...I mean they could have masked it by having the trainer say you are not skilled enough or your strength isn't high enough etc.

Yes, the choice to leave the underwater empty is very unusual considering that there was plenty of underwater content in daggerfall and morrowind. (I remember finding books at the bottom of pools in daggerfall).

Hmm this thread is making me want to go back and investigate morrowind some more.

The real problem with the whole series for me is that it doesn't offer multiple quest solutions. It offers multiple classes but does not differentiate how each class accomplishes a quest. When you throw in a wrinkle of alignment there aren't enough shades of grey in the results...

[Ethric]

It makes absolutely no sense that I have to reach certain level to get certain items and certain monsters - let the player travel to off-world, if necessary to get what player wants even if early on but don't make such limitations.

Indeed, and further, when you do reach a high lvl every bandit and highwayman has supergear. Which is weird. And where's the sense of accomplishment if you don't get the option to take on something you probably shouldn't? Plodding around knowing that what you will encounter will be tailored to your level.

[Caradoc]

I don't know if this would work here, but there is a nethack trick that takes advantage of the parity system. What you do is take your level 1 character down to a tough level without fighting along the way. If there are no monsters set for that level that are weak enough to fight a level one character, the level ends up empty and the player can just loot everything.

I kinda did this in Oblivion when I got the Prince for an early quest. I just hung back and let him do the fighting, which was no problem since I was still a low level crab seller.

[Ethric]

If you really want cheesy, you can set your main skills (the ones that make you go up in level by improving) to some that you don't normally use. That way, you can have great skill in those you do use and still be level one. That way it's a cakewalk.

I like the OOO mod, there's one particular mages guild recommendation quest I still haven't been able to do, as it involved storming a fortress with some bad guys in it. Said bad guys kicked me fleeing out, as opposed to in a "regular" game where they would have mysteriously turned out to be just easy enough for me to overcome.

[Angelspit]

Just got the game (thanks arturs!), started reading the manual and I wonder which class to choose. I'm tempted to pick an orc (duh!), but will going through the game with melee makes the game boring after a while? I'm normally not much of a magic user in RPGs.

[arturchix]

Orc? Not very surprising! I would suggest you to go for might based class. IIRC I made a custom class called Champion and picked such major skills that are very easy to level up. That would be armorer (essential one, you will figure this out when you will attempt to fix magical items), sneak, athletics, long sword/blunt weapon, speechcraft, alchemy and possibly some other skills I have forgot at the moment. If you know how to do, you can get Sneak at 100 even in the very first dungeon.

Remember - you can train only 5 times per level so basically most of the stuff you will have to do yourself and leveling up might take quite a while. Monsters are level scaled so it might be possible that finishing the game with a level 1 character is easier than finishing it with a hero around 20-30th level.

[PhoenixReborn]

Monsters are level scaled so it might be possible that finishing the game with a level 1 character is easier than finishing it with a hero around 20-30th level.

That is certainly true. But I find it more fun to see all the various monsters. Actually, I find the opposite idea annoying, the idea that once you level up to say 20 you're only seeing Daedra and timber wolves but not seeing rats and lions any more. Those are just examples, but you understand right?

[Omega_Destroyer]

I agree. Some variety would be nice. I can only fight so many Daedrotths...

I also find the game to be much easier the more levels you have if you are a fighter. For a thief, it's a different story.

[arturchix]

There's a very interesting video about the upcoming expansion "Shivering isles" available at Youtube, it looks better than I expected.

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

If you don't like level based encounters there are mods that change that. I am fine with them myself.

There are also loot mods that make the good equipment rarer on bandits for example.

GOW

[arturchix]

Is anyone going to play "The Shivering Isles"? It will be released next week, so I've already preordered it.

[Omega_Destroyer]

I would, but I don't have Xbox Live, so I have no way of playing it on my 360.

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

Is anyone going to play "The Shivering Isles"? It will be released next week, so I've already preordered it.

Ah, I already have too many games to play and now this comes out. If only I could get a couple of months vacation approved...

I won't preorder it but I'll grab it as soon as it gets in the stores.

GOW

[Caradoc]

GOW (or other experienced Oblivion players), what mods do you recommend? I am restarting after having lost my savefiles due to a disk error and want to take the opportunity to put in some mods. I'm pleased to say my new computer can handle the graphics quite well, so I will not need Oldblivion.

One that looks good to me is Kobu's character advancement mod, since I'm not particularly fond of the standard 'upside down' skill advancement system.

Also, I got a free copy of Knights of the Nine, but those look rather trivial, as do Bethesda's 'top ten'. I'm less interested in new skins than in additions and improvements to gameplay.

So what do you suggest?

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

I haven't played Obivion in a while, but below are a list of the mods that I have. I have purposely only used a small number of mods to this point.

I would be interested in seeing what mods others use too. I'm sure that there are some great mods out there now.

I am not really interested in uber equipment mods, but am interested in things like cloaks, gloves, hats, different looking weapons&armor, spells (non uber.) I remember somebody was working on a druid mod a while back. I hope he finished it. I would like to play a druid type character.

One thing I found to be annoying was not being able to delete spells from my spellbook. I hope someone has made a mod to do that conviently now.

I did not get the Circle of the Nine mod collection but you'll see from the list of my mods that I have several of the official mods.

I've also gotten the Shivering Isle expansion but haven't had the chance to play it yet.


There may be updated versions of these mods:

FathisFix.esp (thief guild bug fixes)

ReopenGates.esp (re-opens the random Oblivion gates for those that have
finished the Main Quest and for whatever reason want to return to the
plane of Oblivion.)

951-WeatherSpells

1535-1-Night Eye (good mod for cat people)

Compass-Disable_Both.esp
Compass-Disable_POIs.esp
Compass-Disable_QuestMarker.esp

DLCFrostcrag.esp (official mod)
1736-1-Book Placement Wine ADDon-TESSource.esp
DLCHorseArmor.esp (official mod)
DLCOrrery.esp (official mod)
dysesco_Alchemy_Potion_Perk.esp
dyseso_Light_Ingred_Appar.esp
ES4_Alchemists Refernece.esp
Worthwhile_Thievery15p.esp
gloves.esp
RobesUpperBodyOnly.esp
bookplacing.esm
GrayFox'sArmoryv2.0esp (nice looking thief armor)
DCLThievesDen.esp
SigilStonesExpanded1.1.esp
University Cosmetics2.0.esp
Sin'sExpandedLightArmorKit
DLCShiveringIsles.esp (the expansion)

[Caradoc]

Merci beaucoups.