Heroes 5 isn't a true Heroes of Might & Magic game.

[UndeadHalfOrc]

I visit the Celestial Heavens site for the wonderful resources for old Heroes game and M&M. This is the first time I post on the H5 forum.

Normally I would stay there minding my own business, but every time someone posts a picture of a H5 creature on the H1-4 forums, I puke at how ugly it is.

The Heroes franchise died with 3DO/NWC/Jon Van Caneghem. Any jerkoff with money can "buy" a legal property and have the right to sell any product under that name once they own it. Doesn't make it the real deal.

Let's say you're the world's biggest AC/DC fan. Now let's suppose the AC/DC guys decide to sell the AC/DC name to some nobodys with tons of money. And these idiots decide to make a studio album, under the AC/DC name (which they're legally able to). How ******* ridiculous would that sound? Actually KISS toyed around with that idea! (but that's Gene $immon$ to you).

And if it sounds like a Ubisoft hate thread, that's because it unapologeticly is. In their arrogance they didn't even bother to hire some of the people responsible for the old beloved games (like David Mullich for instance) Screw Ubisoft and Nival. I know first hand about Ubisoft's arrogance - I live in the very city where they do most of their development in north america and once knew many guys working there. Mark my words: if I ever get terminal cancer I will bomb their office building to the ground!

Names shouldn't be BOUGHT. A name is a reputation, something you built for yourself through hard work and earned recognition.

What people (game creators) have done in the past when their parent company went under, is regroup together and continue work under a new company, to preserve some legacy. But NWC didn't. So unless some important M&M figure submerges and start working for Ubisoft, the M&M franchise IS dead, folks, no matter what's written on the box, or what's the next parent company is gonna be (I'm looking at you, EA)

[PhoenixReborn]

Let me guess. You don't own Heroes V.

I strongly enjoy the old might and magic (currently playing mm 7)games. Doesn't mean I can't enjoy this one.

Dark Messiah is a much worse affront to the might and magic name than Heroes v.

Gene $immon$

If you had an opportunity to make an easy buck would you do it?

[Elvin]

Tell you what, the game is true to the homm spirit I used to know but improved with some new additions and H4 features. Whether or not you like its art is irrelevant, if you play it enough you will see that most of the broken things have been taken care of as to avoid the old imbalances even if new were created. Still considering the previous games it's pretty balanced.

What I do miss is a decent and engaging storyline that I got with H3 and H4. Although I did not particularly love the H4 world it had excellent campaigns, plot and characters something I cannot say about H5.

[Akul]

Art? Every HoMM had its own art. And art is the most unimportant thing in deciding if H5 is a HoMM game or not.

Once TotE and the last patch are released, H5 shall become the best part of the series. It brought a lot of new features into the series and even succeded into combining some features from H4 with the old formula.

The only bad thing about this game right now is the editor. But I doubt that they even bothered to make a good editor until all planned features are implented.

And Ubisoft taking over the game is a good thing. There are developers who dreamed about turning HoMM into an RTS.

[Elvin]

I am unsure about ubi and the choice of developer but I'm sure it could have been worse. Personally I believe they underperformed but the results are pretty satisfying. The gripe is that it had the potential for greatness and it stayed at just good - I wonder how many things will be improved with TotE.

[okrane]

And Ubisoft taking over the game is a good thing. There are developers who dreamed about turning HoMM into an RTS.

I think that being a turn based game, Heroes has issues on multiplayer.

I mean, I played some hot seat games in my lifetime and they were the longest games I played. It's just me, I temd to get bored while having to wait for my oponent to do his moves.

Now if the game were to be say, a ffa with 6 players I think even Heroes 5 with simultaneous turns, would take hours. And that's a problem.

I'm not saying RTS is the answer, but something must be done, imo

[Elvin]

Heroes was never supposed to be played with many players and there is little to be done without altering the game too much.

[jeff]

And Ubisoft taking over the game is a good thing. There are developers who dreamed about turning HoMM into an RTS.

You and I could not be farther apart on this point, I have consistantly stated my apprehension over UBI's ownership and they have done nothing to change my mind. They are arrogant in there treatment of fans, have continually ignored the fans pleas for improvement, and produced a product that may continue the series only because the H-IV fans disappointed in H-V bought it to just keep it the franchise alive regardless. In my case I refused to buy HOF, but talked my daughters into giving it to me for Christmas. Unfortunately there is no holiday near the Tribes release and so whether I buy that or not is still in question. The H-III fans however would buy it since this is just a 3-D redo of H-III. But as far as it being a true HoMM game, sadly it must be considered that, as like it or not UBI does own it and can (and have) put that name on any product they want. Remember most (not all) series usually end badly.

[Agnus Dei]

Normally I would stay there minding my own business, but every time someone posts a picture of a H5 creature on the H1-4 forums, I puke at how ugly it is.

The Heroes franchise died with 3DO/NWC/Jon Van Caneghem. Any jerkoff with money can "buy" a legal property and have the right to sell any product under that name once they own it. Doesn't make it the real deal.

Chill out dude. Just because it is arguable whether the perfect publisher bought the series doesn't mean that the game is supposed to die along with the old publisher. Would you rather not have Heroes at all? Or some other game with crapy name being a clone of Heroes?
And i think Ubival has done a great job reviving HoMM, but that is another thread.

[ThunderTitan]

Would you rather not have Heroes at all?

In hindsight, it would have been mostly the same, except my brain wouldn't have hurt as much as it did after i played the campaign.

[jeff]

In hindsight, it would have been mostly the same, except my brain wouldn't have hurt as much as it did after i played the campaign.

Or have wasted a week trying to figure out the editor before giving up.

[ThunderTitan]

Atleast the editor does have some logic behind it, as all computer programs... the story on the other hand...

[Omega_Destroyer]

Sorry Orc, but Might & Magic is very much alive whether you like it or not.

[jeff]

Atleast the editor does have some logic behind it, as all computer programs... the story on the other hand...

True, but the editor is supposed to increase fan participation to the maximum extent possible, and in that regards it is as big or bigger failure.

[Akul]

To Jeff:
I have seen teams who are worse to their fans. Some of theme banned the fans who told anything bad about the game.

As to your H3-redone: H5 has too many new features (new skill system, gating, DE Necromancy, Elemental Chain, Artificer, New Initiative system, Rune magic, hero-turns, alternative upgrades, blood rage...) to be called a redo. In that case, H3 is a redo of H2 which is a redo of H1.
While I would also want more of H4 features, H5 gave enough of new ones to satisfy me.

[ThunderTitan]

Faction specific skills are just 1 new feature... And alt upgrades aren't even here yet.

[jeff]

To Jeff:
I have seen teams who are worse to their fans. Some of theme banned the fans who told anything bad about the game.

Well since we are talking of Heroes and M&M, the only other team that is relevant is the 3DO/NWC team, and their forums had very lively debate with several very negative threads/posts. I myself had several posts that fell into that group when discussing MM9, not once did I even get a warning. Where people like HodgePodge got banned (temporarily) for her holy crusade against StarForce. So UBI’s track record is certainly not one to be proud or boast about.

[Akul]

3DO/NWC is dead. Ubival now has the rights. Nothing we say shall change that fact.

And truly I don't care how much they listen to the fans. Give me a good game and I am happy. And I do consider H5 a good game.

Faction specific skills are just 1 new feature... And alt upgrades aren't even here yet.

Thats the reason why I didn't mention Trainer, Dark elven magic and Aveneger.
The skills I mentioned are more complex and can be called features.

As for alts... they shall be here so they can be mantioned.
While not complex, I doubt that future HoMM games would go without theme so I gave it a place here.

[Alamar]

Really the only thing that's bad about UBI is that they are run as a "traditional business" and their primary focus is on the bottom line.

This means they will strike they will balance cost of developing the game [risk] vs. expected returns on the game [rewards] with more of an emphasis on near-term profits [< 5 years] instead of truly long-term [> 10 years] profits.

Because of the business practices it becomes obvious that making "the best game possible" simply isn't a primary goal.

In summary everything that UBI has done can be traced back to simply being a traditional business.

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EDIT: As long as people line up to buy the game, expansions, etc. and don't demand a better game [map editor, documentation, AI, etc.] by refusing to buy the game/expansions we don't have a hope for getting anything better.

[Akul]

No team makes "The best game possible". Every team cares primary about profit. Without profit there is no team, and without the team there is 0% chance to make the wanted game.