Renegade units in Addon

PhoenixReborn · Unread postby **PhoenixReborn** » 02 Sep 2006, 18:12

Horny druid harmfully touches pixie??

soupnazii · Unread postby **soupnazii** » 02 Sep 2006, 18:27

more like "Horny druids illegaly touch topless dancers. 150 damage dealt, 4 died."

DaemianLucifer · Unread postby **DaemianLucifer** » 02 Sep 2006, 18:43

soupnazii wrote:more like "Horny druids illegaly touch topless dancers. 150 damage dealt, 4 died."

And 100 requiring extensive psychiatric counseling.

ThunderTitan · Unread postby **ThunderTitan** » 02 Sep 2006, 19:48

Caradoc wrote: Level 1: Nymphos (Charm)
Level 2: Topless Dancers (Generate Gold)
Level 3: Milf Hunters (Long Shot)
Level 4: Horny Druids (Illegal Touching)
Level 5: Vulgar Unicorns (Mass Blind)
Level 6: Degenerate Treants (Bondage)
Level 7: Fairy Dragons (Spread Disease; Causes Hemorrhoids)

Coming soon... Naughty Elf heroes!

Lvl3's is the best one.

Ya5MieL · Unread postby **Ya5MieL** » 03 Sep 2006, 06:08

Great idea... adding a new town without requiring complete new graphic set sounds like Lazy ppl's idea but in the end ... it gives one additional playable "faction".. which in the end matters the most...

If its a Full-set choice, it can easily be balanced so there is no problem with that... you either pick old set or new set... which makes sense...
unlike having fallen angels supporting palladins (so individual choice doesnt look like a smart idea but somehow i belive nival thinks the same),,,

I hope this is done right and that it will bring more life to heroes 5... along with map generator....

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Nostalgy makes me vote H2 as best heroes game but truth is more closer to H3 being best single player heroes game and H4 being best multi player heroes game... with this new info... H5 sounds like it could de-throne both of them
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Panda Tar · Unread postby **Panda Tar** » 03 Sep 2006, 23:59

Rapid fire...seems it is impossible to miss. Maybe it does full damage all the time. Or, this ability can shoot for a shorter time to act again, for minor damage.

Maybe it is nothing of this, but the way it looks when shooting - very quick.

OH, and about those units, that is somewhat weird. In the website, they say those upgrades won't be available at town, so you'll have to find, er...dwellings or what? And, if you play that campaign, you won't be able to build upgraded buildings on you Heaven town? I thought it a bit odd.

soupnazii · Unread postby **soupnazii** » 04 Sep 2006, 02:15

im sure they have a good way to balance it all out.

LordErtz · Unread postby **LordErtz** » 04 Sep 2006, 02:47

soupnazii wrote:im sure they have a good way to balance it all out.

See that point I'm not so confident in.

asandir · Unread postby **asandir** » 04 Sep 2006, 04:15

i hear ya lordertz, but i will say that it's an interesting idea ....

sylvanllewelyn · Unread postby **sylvanllewelyn** » 04 Sep 2006, 04:48

Personally appreciate Caradoc's humour, but do remember that this forum is not 18+ (in some countries, 21+). Just be a little careful.

I'd say rebels are an extra faction, Dwarves in the good side and Rebel-Haven on the evil side. Although one must remember that there's no "good" or "evil" in Ashan, and that if you read the Ashan history, every faction commited both good and evil due to human(oid?) weaknesses. Elrath is the dragon of light, but light and dark has nothing to do with good and evil in this game.

And where are the followers of Sylath?

Gljivko a.k.a Vortex · Unread postby **Gljivko a.k.a Vortex** » 04 Sep 2006, 08:45

Well, I suggest to calm down and see what expansion actually brings. And concerning this "new" haven town I would give you one example:

If you remembered, when expansion of warcraft 3 came, it offered a new playable race Naga but only as a campaign feature, so I believe that if Nival is aware of possible unbalance they will probably include this option only for campaign.

asandir · Unread postby **asandir** » 04 Sep 2006, 08:57

i think JJ has pretty much already stated that this is the case (not absolutely sure of this though)

player1 · Unread postby **player1** » 04 Sep 2006, 09:14

Gljivko a.k.a Vortex wrote:If you remembered, when expansion of warcraft 3 came, it offered a new playable race Naga but only as a campaign feature, so I believe that if Nival is aware of possible unbalance they will probably include this option only for campaign.

Well, the things is Naga's where never complete race, they only had a few buildings and a few units.

Only in combiation with blood elves they where complete enough to be called a factiom.

Jolly Joker · Unread postby **Jolly Joker** » 04 Sep 2006, 09:23

At this stage, for this addon, it's a campaign-only feature.
However, I don't think that Nival will through the idea outta the window and be done with it then.

asandir · Unread postby **asandir** » 04 Sep 2006, 09:26

it would be quite the effort to end up - potentially - with 9 factions (allows for adding the naga faction in next addon - yes there will be another addon, and yes it will add a naga faction - why??, cause that's what i'd love to see

) and then allow for an alternate upgrade path for each of those .... now that is variety!!!

although i can imagine that if they took this path the balancing would be really awkward to get right

Jolly Joker · Unread postby **Jolly Joker** » 04 Sep 2006, 09:48

I think, that balance is a very sensitive issue. You cannot simple compare something like the combined creature power, you have to consider a lot more things, for example race-specific (advanced) abilities of heroes. Take for example Teleport Assault and let's check things a bit from here on.
It's a logistic based ability for
a) Warlock (easy to get)
b) Demon Lord
c) Wizard.
First thing is, the ability is ALOT better than the Teleport spell because it boosts Initiative of the teleported unit as well.
For a Warlock this ability makes them Hydras a living nightmare for any opponent, right? For the Demon Lords, well, those Pit Lords ARE pretty effective as soon as you get them into the ballgame, right.
Lastly, a Wizard has even two eligible units, Golems and Rakshasas.
Note that a Ranger, who clearly has an eligible unit - Treants, cannot get it (albeit the Teleport spell would cure this problem, at least partly), while Haven simply has no need for it because their high level units are all pretty mobile and the Squires do well in halving shooting damage. That leaves the Undead who cannot get EITHER - and don't need them really.
So balance is very difficult to judge in a game with so many ways to influence the course of things.
I don't think, it would be too difficult to come up with a "balanced" second upgrade line-up for each town. The difficulty lies in changing the nature of the army.

asandir · Unread postby **asandir** » 04 Sep 2006, 09:53

you may be right JJ, but i suspect that having potentially 9 factions with an alternate upgrade path (which kinda gives you 18 possible "factions") creates a balance nightmare, i agree that it depends on the units powers and overall combination with the hero's skills and abilities, but if anything that may make it more difficult to balance then easier .... however if it can be done then it would be very impressive

DaemianLucifer · Unread postby **DaemianLucifer** » 04 Sep 2006, 12:12

stefan.urlus wrote:you may be right JJ, but i suspect that having potentially 9 factions with an alternate upgrade path (which kinda gives you 18 possible "factions") creates a balance nightmare, i agree that it depends on the units powers and overall combination with the hero's skills and abilities, but if anything that may make it more difficult to balance then easier .... however if it can be done then it would be very impressive

I disagree.A perfect balance of enormous amount of towns doesnt mean a perfect game.They balanced the races now and they look bland.In HIII we had so much filler units because of the balance,and thats not a good thing.

sylvanllewelyn wrote: I'd say rebels are an extra faction, Dwarves in the good side and Rebel-Haven on the evil side. Although one must remember that there's no "good" or "evil" in Ashan, and that if you read the Ashan history, every faction commited both good and evil due to human(oid?) weaknesses. Elrath is the dragon of light, but light and dark has nothing to do with good and evil in this game.

Please,good and evil are so obvious in this game.Even the haven has been split in two so that the original units wont follow the wrong path

Tysar · Unread postby **Tysar** » 04 Sep 2006, 12:34

I agree with DM on the second thing... how are Necromancers or Demons not evil? Destruction, causing pain and suffering is all they've been created for. Apart from that, it's just about individuals though.

Akul · Unread postby **Akul** » 04 Sep 2006, 13:06

Well, nekromancers are only fighting for power against the wizards. In fact, undead aren't evil. They don't have feelings. They do what is needed.

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Renegade units in Addon

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