Ideas for next mods

[Lost]

AI is one of the tested features in 3.6. We got some improvements in Adventure and Heroes Development AI, along with some "smartness" when dividing armies, intoduced in 3.5.

[Le_Faucheur]

4 vampires per week would be extremly powerful,no?
I know they are undead but it also immune them against some curses,and mind control spell.

I have a lots of idea to improve creatures,but it would modify the game a lot:

life:
balista:speed:3,move on adventure map:18
monk:spellcaster(exorcism,bless,stone skin,necromancy rune,holy word(10-15 damages per monk))maybe no melee penalty,like in heroes 3
champion:move on battlefield:11 or 12
angel:increase morale by 1

nature:
leprechaun:always lucky.immuned to misfortune
sprite:attacks on 3 cases(or growth 18-19)
satyr:always good morale.immuned to sorrow
elf:no obstacles penalty
griffin:hit and run
unicorn:friendly units close to it,get +30% magic resistance
faerie dragon:can cast hell,or chain lightning(or both)once they are 24 in a stack

order:
magi:shooter,no shooting penalty,40% luck to cast dispel when they shoot an enemy
golem:can stun
dragon golem:2 retaliation(maybe too powerful,but in another way,it's one of the hardest level 4 to get)
titan:immuned to fear

death:

zombi:can cast shout of death(cost 3,decrease the morale of all enemies by 10 during one turn).mana:8
cerberus:attack:18,defense:18
ghost:damage:3-4,destroy mana to heal theirself
gargoyle:26 pv,50% magic resistance
venom spawn:immune to poison

devil:spell caster(sparks(27 damages per devil),firewall(used like the quicksand.anyone who go through isn't stopped,but receive damages(20 damages per devil)),armaggeddon(30 damages per devil),and of course summon ice demon),mana:12

bone dragon:the power of the fear depends on the moral of the attacked unit.if the attacked unit has a good morale this turn,she has 50% luck to not fear and retaliate.if she doesn't have neither a good or a bad morale,the fear works as usual.if she have a bad morale,she have 50% luck to lose her turn/lose initiative for this turn.

chaos:
rogue:first strike(maybe too powerful)
pirate:no boarding penalty
troll:can stun
efreet:spellcaster(magic arrow(10 damages per efreet),disruption ray,smoke,spell shackle,fire aura)mana:10
nightmare:+10% damage if it waits before attacking

might:
cyclops:can stun(in melee)
behemoth:destroy a door in one hit.can displace an enemy when hitting it(if the player choose the option,like with the hit and run)
thunderbird:can strike without using his physical attack(only the lightning),it prevents the enemy from retaliating.

[theGryphon]

Wow, that's a lot of changes!
I like the Behemoth's door shattering ability

[Le_Faucheur]

forgot this one:
mummy:spellcaster(waspswarm,animate dead)

[Akul]

forgot this one:
mummy:spellcaster(waspswarm,animate dead)

In H3, they could be spellcasters because they look like spellcasters. But in H4, they just don't seem like spellcasters. And mumies are good units alredy.

[Le_Faucheur]

yeah,I was inspired by heroes 3's mummy!
but they are neutral,so it could be fun!
I thought about the growth of 4 per week for the cyclops.
I think it would be better if you decrease their attack and defense to 22(makes them more balanced)

[Black Ghost]

@ Le_Faucheur:

1.vamps could be cheaper but NOT more numerous

2.champs IMO need only better "charge", btw. how does it really work? (I mean values per speed points)

3.monks could get onlu spellcastine ability, but with fewer spells than proposed^ (will be too good)

4.angels: nice idea, but aren't they good enough?

5.I like immunition to sorrow&misfortune by satyr and leprechaun

6. as for griffins, IMO it's bad idea. It should be in the cente of the combat, especially with 'snake strike" casted on it;)

7.as for Order I can agree only with titan immune to mind spells (including terror/blind/confusion/etc.)

8.should cerberus have 19/19, increase its cost to 210

9.devils AREN'T spelcasting troops -.-' , there were some voices about "no retaliation" which IMO would be the only sensible modification, but araid of making d. too strong.
I'd go for "negate f.strike"

10.interesting idea of fear/morale. IMO it should be bound with morale-bonus not bn.dragon skil, so it could also affect "terror"...

11.great idea with no-bording penalty for pirates

12. IMO efreets shouldn't be spellcasters

13. As for nightmare, I'd suggest giving +10%dmg bonus per every -1 of morale of attacked unit (unit with sorrow will receive double dmg)

14. Bandits with FS? undoubtedly too powerful

15. As for might only behemoth's gate-smashing sounds interesting

[klaymen]

and what about angel's skill as was in H3 - increase morale of allied units. because presence of angels, strong supernaturnal creatures that can ressurect dead makes them feel stronger, better, they feel they have chance to win...

[eekstah]

Suggestion for new Adventure object: "Invisible" Quest Gate.

It would be a mix of Placed Event and Quest Gate - Invisible to the player, but unpassable as long as Quest Requirement = False.

Example: Your hero comes to a part of the map that you're not expected to explore yet, because of story or other quests. This part of the map is more "rocky", has more dense forrest and mountains etc... it just "seems less passable". Therefore you want only heroes with Expert Pathfinding to be able to pass.

The existing ways to deal with this is
a) Quest hut -> if heroes had exp.Pathfinding, then set of bomb that removes a rock that blocks the way
b) Quest Guard/Gate that says "Stop, only Exp.Pathfinders" may pass!"

None of those is good alternatives compared to
c) you reach the decreasingly passable part of the map, and the Hero feels uncomfortable walking in these terrains, some text tells you that he better learn some Pathfinding before he continues.

[Le_Faucheur]

1.vamps could be cheaper but NOT more numerous

2.champs IMO need only better "charge", btw. how does it really work? (I mean values per speed points)

the charge is good enough I think,but sometimes the champions can't act during a battle(especially if you have the 3 shooters)

3.monks could get onlu spellcastine ability, but with fewer spells than proposed^ (will be too good)

for example?

4.angels: nice idea, but aren't they good enough?

yeah,but it isn't too powerful I think

5.I like immunition to sorrow&misfortune by satyr and leprechaun

6. as for griffins, IMO it's bad idea. It should be in the cente of the combat, especially with 'snake strike" casted on it;)

it's because I find it weak,moreover my friends don't like the preserve,and I find it less good than most of the other factions too
(especially because level 1 and 3 are a bit weak)

7.as for Order I can agree only with titan immune to mind spells (including terror/blind/confusion/etc.)

it's immune to fear(including terror,fear aura,and so on...)immune against mind spells would immune them against precision(or accuracy?)I think

8.should cerberus have 19/19, increase its cost to 210

possible too,anyway I think they are too weak.a white tiger is stronger than a cerberus,it makes no sense!

9.devils AREN'T spelcasting troops -.-' , there were some voices about "no retaliation" which IMO would be the only sensible modification, but araid of making d. too strong.
I'd go for "negate f.strike"

it's a way to make them more chaotic(moreover you need the chaos annex to build them),and also because my friends(especially one)think they suck...

10.interesting idea of fear/morale. IMO it should be bound with morale-bonus not bn.dragon skil, so it could also affect "terror"...

explain a bit more

11.great idea with no-bording penalty for pirates

it isn't my idea

12. IMO efreets shouldn't be spellcasters

I wanted one spellcaster by faction,and efreets were the best one in asylum

13. As for nightmare, I'd suggest giving +10%dmg bonus per every -1 of morale of attacked unit (unit with sorrow will receive double dmg)

a bit too powerful,maybe with a lower percentage...

14. Bandits with FS? undoubtedly too powerful

probably,but since they have stealth,they should be able to surprise their ennemies!

15. As for might only behemoth's gate-smashing sounds interesting

[Black Ghost]

@Le_Faucheur

the charge is good enough I think,but sometimes the champions can't act during a battle(especially if you have the 3 shooters)

well, I experienced some battles that my champs had chaotic charge bonus. Riding over half battlefield they dealt only a bit more dmg that fighting in close melees.

Quote:
3.monks could get onlu spellcastine ability, but with fewer spells than proposed^ (will be too good)

for example?

the case is in balancing monks. The question is also should they have 1spelll or whole s.c.ability. Than should be taken in consideration their cost/growth/stats. IMO it should be mainly ranged unit only with little slash of magic not to waste hero's turn on single spell. The spells aslo shouln'd be IMO the best of magic school but mildly bound with monk-lifestyle:
-exorcism [2mana]/m.exor[5](25 monks)
-d.ward[3]
-necromancy ward[5]
Spell points=5
stats don'y need changes, mabye a bit more XP than

I'm considering Spiritual Armour[2] instead D.Ward, but having celestial (mass)armour[5] would be powerful >=]

yeah,but it isn't too powerful I think

(angels)
hmm, +1 morale, not cumulated with number of nagels and/or angel army slots mabye isn't too much but demand -1morale for devil (logically) or -1 luck(bound with chaos anex and misfortune spells)

it's because I find it weak,moreover my friends don't like the preserve,and I find it less good than most of the other factions too
(especially because level 1 and 3 are a bit weak

(griffin)
I see, and wish g. had 20/20 but it has a huge potential, and unlimited-retal is really powerful, moreover it's not middle lev. unit like in Heroes 1-3, so with 95HP it can live long.
ps. are unicorns also weak for 3rd lev. creature? or tigers for 2nd?

Oh, and bear in mind that preserve has summoning also on adv.map, so having everyday 1 free even 19/19 griffin is huge boost.

i

t's immune to fear(including terror,fear aura,and so on...)immune against mind spells would immune them against precision(or accuracy?)I think

(titan)
hmm, I was actually thinking of spells enslaving mind (like also Blind, Confusion) and stealing turn (song of Peace, Wasp swarm)-> titans from H1-3 were immune to them, but you still blessed them and cast positive spells. Why couldn't H4 titans be simmilar?

white tiger is stronger than a cerberus,it makes no sense!

thats true, agree that as demonic side of Death cerberus should be strong unit, but there's signifant diffrence between special abilities.
you can retaliate against FS,moreover c. can hit 3units
From my point of view cerberi shouldn't be too stronger as Tiger is 2nd best lev2 stats creature behind nomad(naturally might units are the strongest)

t's a way to make them more chaotic(moreover you need the chaos annex to build them),and also because my friends(especially one)think they suck...

hmm, anex..., but armageddon isn't good idea for that (30dmg/devil, f.dragons fireball is stronger a bit and doesnt harm you).
Furthermore, chaos has fire-resisted efreets & dragons, so it can cast A. without losses.
Unfortunatly I dont see suitable spells from Chaos for devil

Quote:
10.interesting idea of fear/morale. IMO it should be bound with morale-bonus not bn.dragon skil, so it could also affect "terror"...

explain a bit more

morale bonus gives your troops chance do deal more DMG and act faster.
It's some kind of battle fervor, willing to kick as many opps as possible. I imagine that more enthusiastic creatures could get also chance to resist fright not only from Bn.Dragon attack, but also 'Terror" and "Aura of Fear".
Value could be 5% per +1morale, so max 10morale grant 50% chance to resist any form of fear...

I wanted one spellcaster by faction,and efreets were the best one in asylum

spellcasters are characteristic feature of Academy-> magic devoted faction, other ones has some units to cast single spell but as ability, not magic talent

Quote:
13. As for nightmare, I'd suggest giving +10%dmg bonus per every -1 of morale of attacked unit (unit with sorrow will receive double dmg)

a bit too powerful,maybe with a lower percentage...

hmm, chaos doesn't have morale lowering spells (misfortune affetcs luck), so it would have problem to fully use nightmares attacks.
Death splash can be solution but single Sorrow (Advanced D.Magic) won't salvate the battle, and 4th Mass Sorrow is probably unreachable unless you resign from Chaos M. developement.
Of course you can also use Beholders (external swelling needed) to have 11% to cast sorrow

Normally, armies tend to be mono-faction or alligned so morale is +1 or 0 (no nightmare effect), non alligned multi armies have -2morale so only +20% so not so much (probably 1/2 of charge effect). Only reall enemy in one armie have -4, but usually granted with tactican or Mirth spell, so IMO won't be gamebreaker

Thanks for reply

[Crusard]

It would be a mix of Placed Event and Quest Gate - Invisible to the player, but unpassable as long as Quest Requirement = False.

Sounds like an interesting idea. The only problem I can imagine is that if the player wants to click on the ground ahead he won't see the "horse" icon, so it could be a bit tricky to find the hidden quest gate. Maybe instead of invisible it could be some sort of rocky platform, or with a lot of vegetation...

[eekstah]

The only problem I can imagine is that if the player wants to click on the ground ahead he won't see the "horse" icon, so it could be a bit tricky to find the hidden quest gate.

Yes, I have thought of that. Maybe the "horse icon" should appear, but the message from the quest should come up as soon as you decide to walk past the quest, even though you're not standing right next to it.

[Crusard]

This can be worked around by using a placed event right before the quest gate, which closes it as soon as you step on. This can be tricky though.

[Le_Faucheur]

Quote:
the charge is good enough I think,but sometimes the champions can't act during a battle(especially if you have the 3 shooters)

well, I experienced some battles that my champs had chaotic charge bonus. Riding over half battlefield they dealt only a bit more dmg that fighting in close melees.
Quote:

that's strange

Quote:
3.monks could get onlu spellcastine ability, but with fewer spells than proposed^ (will be too good)

for example?

the case is in balancing monks. The question is also should they have 1spelll or whole s.c.ability. Than should be taken in consideration their cost/growth/stats. IMO it should be mainly ranged unit only with little slash of magic not to waste hero's turn on single spell. The spells aslo shouln'd be IMO the best of magic school but mildly bound with monk-lifestyle:
-exorcism [2mana]/m.exor[5](25 monks)
-d.ward[3]
-necromancy ward[5]
Spell points=5
stats don'y need changes, mabye a bit more XP than

I'm considering Spiritual Armour[2] instead D.Ward, but having celestial (mass)armour[5] would be powerful >=]

defensive spells!why not.I liked the holy word,but it's true that it could be very powerful in some cases!
I thought about celestial armour too,and found it too powerful

Quote:
yeah,but it isn't too powerful I think
(angels)
hmm, +1 morale, not cumulated with number of nagels and/or angel army slots mabye isn't too much but demand -1morale for devil (logically) or -1 luck(bound with chaos anex and misfortune spells

) I thought about that too,but I find the spellcaster ability more funny!

Quote:
it's because I find it weak,moreover my friends don't like the preserve,and I find it less good than most of the other factions too
(especially because level 1 and 3 are a bit weak
(griffin)
I see, and wish g. had 20/20 but it has a huge potential, and unlimited-retal is really powerful, moreover it's not middle lev. unit like in Heroes 1-3, so with 95HP it can live long.
ps. are unicorns also weak for 3rd lev. creature? or tigers for 2nd?

Oh, and bear in mind that preserve has summoning also on adv.map, so having everyday 1 free even 19/19 griffin is huge boost.

yeah unicorn aren't that weak,but they aren't that strong neither.

Quote:
t's immune to fear(including terror,fear aura,and so on...)immune against mind spells would immune them against precision(or accuracy?)I think
(titan)
hmm, I was actually thinking of spells enslaving mind (like also Blind, Confusion) and stealing turn (song of Peace, Wasp swarm)-> titans from H1-3 were immune to them, but you still blessed them and cast positive spells. Why couldn't H4 titans be simmilar?

don't know if you can do that.

Quote:
white tiger is stronger than a cerberus,it makes no sense!

thats true, agree that as demonic side of Death cerberus should be strong unit, but there's signifant diffrence between special abilities.
you can retaliate against FS,moreover c. can hit 3units
From my point of view cerberi shouldn't be too stronger as Tiger is 2nd best lev2 stats creature behind nomad(naturally might units are the strongest)

the harpy isn't that strong.I agree that the cerberus shouldn't have as good stats as the tiger,but it shouldn't look weak in comparison neither...

Quote:
t's a way to make them more chaotic(moreover you need the chaos annex to build them),and also because my friends(especially one)think they suck...

hmm, anex..., but armageddon isn't good idea for that (30dmg/devil, f.dragons fireball is stronger a bit and doesnt harm you).
Furthermore, chaos has fire-resisted efreets & dragons, so it can cast A. without losses.
Unfortunatly I dont see suitable spells from Chaos for devil

yeah,but faerie dragon sucks in melee combat.armaggeddon is stronger than fireball,since you hit all ennemies unit.you can do an army with 3 heroes with 100% magic resistance,and devil,on which you cast vampiric touch for example!

[eekstah]

This can be worked around by using a placed event right before the quest gate, which closes it as soon as you step on. This can be tricky though.

I would prefer the other one, but off course this would work too.

A simple OR would do much of the trick; "if [your actual quest] OR "pass"=TRUE" - and a quest switches "pass" off right before you reach the quest. A small problem is that the quest will not enter the Quest Log until you actually walk up to it.

One more thing: This thing should "overwrite" any other adventure objects. What I mean is that it could be place on any.. ehm, entryway? (like the yellow half square in pictore below), creating a quest to enter whatever you want... if you understand me.


This way any artifact, town, dwelling, power up... whatever, can be "quested"

[Le_Faucheur]

giving a fire aura to the efreet instead of a fire shield could be great,because more you are strong in tactics,more you do damage,more you suffer from efreet.also your efreets receive less damages,so their shield is less powerful.so if you are playing against IA with a tactician,nightmares seem way better than efreets.

[Crusard]

This way any artifact, town, dwelling, power up... whatever, can be "quested"

Hmmm, that actually sounds like a great idea...
The only problem I can think of would be that this event would need to override whatever's under it, so I don't know how you could set the "priority" so the game doesn't read whatever's under this event...
But if this works, I think it would add a lot of possibilities (pretty much every object could be scripted!)

Let's see what Lost can say to this...

[jeff]

I am sorry if this has been requested earlier, but this thread is so long now I just quickly skimmed through it and did not see this.

Can you create a few artifacts that can be renamed in the editor. Now they would not need any attributes other than they would be recognized by a conditional statement. Example the quest is to find the "Heart of a Fiend", so the quest requirement would be army has artifact "Heart of the Fiend".

[Akul]

I am sorry if this has been requested earlier, but this thread is so long now I just quickly skimmed through it and did not see this.

Can you create a few artifacts that can be renamed in the editor. Now they would not need any attributes other than they would be recognized by a conditional statement. Example the quest is to find the "Heart of a Fiend", so the quest requirement would be army has artifact "Heart of the Fiend".

I agree with him.
I would also like to be able to change the artifact descriptions. Perhaps you should make an sub-program (like face tool, just for artifacts) if it is imposible to put into editor (BTW, is there a little, tiny chance to upgrade the FT to ADD heroes?)