The Damage is Already Done

[jeff]

They have been asked, but not answered. I believe we want to continue to ask these questions until they do answer. Eventually I hope that if enough people through multiple venues continue to ask them; then they may realize the interest in these questions and answer them. If for no other reason so they can move on to answering other questions.

[Kalah]

It's true. Fans have been asking about the RMG ever since the announcement. That was in August. The only answers ever given have been something like: "we're working hard on this issue" and "we're really putting an effort into the map edtors", they have never actually confirmed that the RMG is a go. I mean, how hard is it to say "yes" or "no"?

[Panda Tar]

So far, my true question would be: what's the really new and engaging feature they are going to present to justify the whole game and if it's an innovation of any kind. Simply I won't buy a game that's merely a jigsaw of its predecessors.

[Sligneris]

I think there are numerous possibilities preventing them from revealing such info. For example, they might not even know whether they're going to implement some features or not as the development is still not finished. Another possibility is that they can't leak info just like that and it's information meant to be revealed at the later point in time.

[Groovy]

I'm with Panda on this. My phrasing would be: what game mechanics will make this edition stand out from its predecessors?

[Galaad]

Personally I think the general art direction and Ashan pretending (aside a few easter eggs) NWC's universe never existed is core of the problem with old timers not interested in H7.

@Panda: I will try to implement your question somewhere, post it in the HC thread at least, you need to post there anyway in order to obtain your Pandavatar hohoho.

Edit: Good phrasing Groovy, I think I can just stick that one as it is inside the Q&A. Yep, I just did.

Edit2: Of course RMG and SIM TURNS are on the list.

[Sligneris]

Personally I think the general art direction and Ashan pretending (aside a few easter eggs) NWC's universe never existed is core of the problem with old timers not interested in H7.

They do not pretend it never existed, they just made another one... Honestly, there were even some mentions that these worlds could be placed in the same, well, universe, but I honestly wouldn't even like them connected in any way, since, well... I don't believe the original universe to be all that great.

[Panda Tar]

I think they didn't need to change, but improve in writing quality and creativity. But as I also don't care much about lore (in Heroes games, that is), it's a neutral ground to me. I only related Ashan with a bad thing because both games in that world weren't too amusing to me. H5 was rather ok, but H6 was ... was ... diabolically awfully terribly dreadfully appalling.

[Galaad]

H5 was rather ok

Well that's the thing. H5 was no more than ok, despite its gameplay.

[Panda Tar]

Yeah, that's when all this fancy graphics tosh started to take over, and some things they could have improved, evolved or introduced were a bit ignored. The most fun part of the game was basically the skill wheel - which is not enough.

[Galaad]

I agree. Yet the art direction taken by Ubi affecting aesthetics has nothing to do with the ones defining the Heroes we know, which were more Sword & Sorcery inspired, while now we get LoTR all over the place, along WoW/WH bad ripoffs. And their ideas of innovations in gameplay were quite catastrophic indeed with H6. To me, H5 failed on aesthetics, and H6 failed on both aesthetics and gameplay aspects. H7 already failed on aesthetics, even if it looks better than both H5 and H6, IMO, still is far to be on par with H2/H3 on that aspect. I wish for an improved gameplay built upon the H5 system with a couple of ideas which wouldn't clash with how the game is played. There is so much to choose from and/or get inspired by WoG scripts ie, I don't understand why they keep looking away in that regard.

So the sad part is, they want fancy graphics, but they fail here, and gameplay still is not improved. ...
And I am not even mentioning reused assets or straight out recycled models, the community had to drive itself insane just to avoid having a full Elite tier of Necro of recycled units.
And lore ... Even if the writing gets better, the main problem is still there. Dragon gods, DE, spidercult etc ... basically down our throats.

[Panda Tar]

Right, posted some questions there.

[Sligneris]

Galaad, I do realize we have the old Heroes cult here, but are you honestly saying H2 and H3 had the best visuals?

[Galaad]

I am saying H1, H2 and H3 defined the Heroes atmosphere (and even the sadly too rushed H4). Ubi made something else, imo explaining the big loss of fans.

[Panda Tar]

Aside that, the great gap between installments may also have contributed (loss of fans). Most people simply started enjoying something else or never came to be aware of anything new.

[Konfuzius]

Galaad, I do realize we have the old Heroes cult here, but are you honestly saying H2 and H3 had the best visuals?

My first game was Heroes 5, I like playing Heroes 6 and I even played Heroes 3 for a while and even I partially agree. I like the visuals of Heroes 6 but Heroes 3 and Heroes 2 really has some amazing art who was created by very talanted people. On top of that, good 2D art ages very well.

I and many other still think that the Heroes 2 Ghost has been be best so far:


Back when NWC was working on MM, everything had its own identity and a very talanted and creative team behind it who created something new based on known mythology (similar to the Warhammer fantasy universe imo).

With more recent titles, Ubisoft didn't even try to make anything new.

Heck, the "spider cult" Necropolis Ubisoft seems to be so obsessed isn't that much different from the Tomb Lords from Warhammer.


So it are not really the graphics but rather the atmosphere and art which makes them still good games (although I think they have dated gameplay).

Edit: broken link

[Panda Tar]

I and many other still think that the Heroes 2 Ghost has been be best so far.

Indeed. Not only visually, but the sound effects of it were fittingly eerie.

[mr.hackcrag]

The creature and town evolution polls speak volumes (though it hasn't been updated since H5).

[Darkström]

I agree. Yet the art direction taken by Ubi affecting aesthetics has nothing to do with the ones defining the Heroes we know, which were more Sword & Sorcery inspired, while now we get LoTR all over the place, along WoW/WH bad ripoffs. And their ideas of innovations in gameplay were quite catastrophic indeed with H6. To me, H5 failed on aesthetics, and H6 failed on both aesthetics and gameplay aspects. H7 already failed on aesthetics, even if it looks better than both H5 and H6, IMO, still is far to be on par with H2/H3 on that aspect. I wish for an improved gameplay built upon the H5 system with a couple of ideas which wouldn't clash with how the game is played. There is so much to choose from and/or get inspired by WoG scripts ie, I don't understand why they keep looking away in that regard.

So the sad part is, they want fancy graphics, but they fail here, and gameplay still is not improved. ...
And I am not even mentioning reused assets or straight out recycled models, the community had to drive itself insane just to avoid having a full Elite tier of Necro of recycled units.
And lore ... Even if the writing gets better, the main problem is still there. Dragon gods, DE, spidercult etc ... basically down our throats.

Well said. I absolutely agree. The atmosphere in the Ubi games is very different from the NWC games.

[mr.hackcrag]

Thanks for quoting that. I didn't read it first time around and it deserves a second look.