Last But Not Least, the Haven Tips

[zerck]

After such a good Dungeon strategy guide this is like a joke.

if you won't write a detailed strategy then dont write at all.

this guide has no point. even new player don't need to read this as it's only a list of haven units and abilities.it doesn't include a real strategy or information i can't get anywhere else. this guide is so useless like saying 'Newcomers to heroes V be informed that archers in this game have bows and they shoot.'

please delete this strategy and write something like dungeon's.

[Cyrox]

Yea agreed. Please improve on the haven guide.
Edited on Thu, Oct 12 2006, 01:30 by Cyrox

[Istari]

I can't believe focusing your army upgrading peasants to marksman wasn't a posted strategy. Lots and lots of marksman is a very good thing, especially with Dougal

[ORy]

Did anyone consider the possibility to skip logistics skill, beacuse of the Haven special building, the Stables which improves your movement for the whole week? Sure, I know the drawback is the need to return to your town at the end of each week.. any comments?

[Mytical]

I agree with Tearofasha's assessment of the skills. The skill selection is top notch, and the reasoning sound. I would; however, like to add in a odd (but useful) 3rd choice for the luck/defense options. Now you may think I am crazy but I would suggest war-machines. Further I would suggest NOT getting tripple ballista. Instead go for the trifecta of balista, catapult, and first aid tent. By now you probably think..is she nuts? Quite possibly but here me out. Ballista adds an extra attack (and lets you aim), catapult and first aid I will cover seperately. One extra attack is not much, but if you get the main skill might as well get all the skills under it you can.

Now Catapult..your asking 'why?'. Your marksmen don't worry about the walls, sure it reduces their damage but that is nothing. Griffins, hey they fly. Squires ..they are better hanging back protecting your marksmen. Priests are ranged, again why worry about the wall, and the AA's fly. First there are two things. The towers..the faster you take them down the less damage they do. Your paladins. They are your heavy hitters, your backbone..and they sit outside a gate twiddling their thumbs. Not with this skill they won't (for long). Lets them get in and start dealing some massive damage.

First Aid tent. Again your probably wondering what drugs I am on. The skill is all but useless. Well here is the thing. Your Marksmen are kinda frail (ish) and die a lot. Ressurrect helps BUT it reduces their hp total. The solution..you guessed it First Aid skill. Not only does it allow you to heal more hp, but to ressurrect them WITHOUGT reducing the hp's. Win/Win. Sure it's frail, yep the enemy will aoe it, but since it is replaced for free at end of battle, it is just something else the enemy has to target besides those marksmen.

[Faiz]

Dark magic should be put on "Visa" it is a great skill to have. And this guide is overeal a big joke...

[Inisto]

Speaking about jokes:The lazyness of the creator is such that he types ''Imp,.Griffins.Someone might mistake that for infernal hawks or something.

[lord_demion]

I have to agree that this is a weak strategy guide. I'm relatively new and can easily spot some obvious problems with this guide:



1) Weakening Strike - This affects Mark of the Damned AND Retributive Strike. The first is for demon lords and the other is for knights. (and well worth it)

2) Retributive Strike is not as bad as it is described here. Even under normal combat it is at least a full replacement for a heroes direct attack. (Plus it gains +3 levels) but it works really well with a stack of griffins (unlimited retaliation) thrown into the battle as fodder. Your other stacks (arch-angels, paladins, first aid tent, etc and your own resurrection spells) keep the griffins alive while they dismember the meele units that attack it en-masse. Add in the above weakening strike and quickly the enemy attacks to less and less damage to said griffins.

3) peasant s are not truly worthless. You can have them collecting income until you build the structures/learn skills/collect money to upgrade them to archers. the money they collect is free and in addition to the cost you would pay anyways when you can afford to upgrade. Effectively by spending the money in the treasury at the start (that normally sits there) effectively collects interest.

4) Fallen Knight ability only affects the dark magic spells. (Still worth getting but it does not affect haste.)

5) The First Aid ability does more than allow you to choose the stack you heal... a) It doubles the tent's HP and immediately recovers the tent if lost in battle. b) It allows you to not only heal but to resurrect lost units. This means your 10 HP marksman are not just healed of up to 9 HP of damage, but at expert level war machines it resurrects 10 whole men.

6) Destruction and Summoning Magic choices are correct but for the wrong reasons... While yes you will not get many summoning or destructive spells from your home town, it is unlikely in any game that you won't capture enemy towns. You will also find them in shrines, on artifacts or from some skills. The reason to avoid them however is low spell power. The damage spells and summoning spells need power to be of any value. Light and dark magic do not require much power and thus are suited to Knights and the way they boost their troops.

[Ceres]

Umm... may I know how'd you guys manage to make a lot of Paladins? Coz I tried it a few times and the largest I can get is just 30, 1 stack only. And can I also have an idea how could I rush making them. Should I skip some building upgrades? or? I really don't know.

[winterfate]

Training.

You can make the Training Grounds at your town, train your Priests into Cavaliers, and lastly upgrade those Cavaliers into Paladins.

I'm not so sure either, since I stopped playing Haven when patch 2.1 came out.

I'm sure the basic strategy involves skipping the Footmen and Griffin dwellings (at least that's how I used to do it).

[Ceres]

I see. Is there no other creatures that I could train in the training grounds other than Priests?

[winterfate]

Yes.

You can train any human unit into the next human unit in rank.

So, a full training would be:

Peasant > Archer > Footman > Priest > Cavalier

By extension, Griffins and Angels cannot be trained into anything, just upgraded into Imperial Griffins and Archangels.

You can also train the upgraded units, but it's cheaper to train the unupgraded units (the way it was made I guess).

[Grail Quest]

I'm crunching through The Queen for a second time, and some of the things I've noticed are:



(1) Angels are harder to use by the time you get them, than the stack of Cavaliers you already have. Usually by then I can split my jousting stack and still have them do bad damage while the Angels must move more carefully. And then the AI hero likes going after angels, meaning you will probably lose at least one per battle no matter what.

(2) Against Inferno, it's risky to put all three of Angels/ArchAngels, Cavaliers/Paladins, and Griffins/Imperial Griffins out because usually at least one will get hit by the Cerebus or the Hell Charger in the opening turn. Against the AI, I choose two stacks and put them at the ends, which means the Inferno high-initiative units can't reach them and usually move forward to stall in the middle of the field.

(3) I found that Benediction and/or Haste can improve Imperial Griffins so well that they often land from their Dives and can still act before lower initiative units like Pit Fiends. So you can immediately send them up and the Fiends never get to act against your Griffins.

(4) ArchAngel Ressurection is nice, but hard to use if you need to wait for their turn to come up while there are fast-moving enemies on the field. Can someone give me a good strategy with that?

(5) Since Mass Haste worked so nicely, I re-played the game to try to give Isabel Mass Haste, Mass Slow, and high Leadership (due to skill picks, I won't have it all by the end of The Queen, though), and I was disappointed to see no one mentioned this synergy at all and whether it works well. I've seen Mass Haste fill the initiative bar with just my units. I figure if I combine it with Mass Slow for synergy, it'll be even better yet. Then, pile on Benediction and Divine Guidance, the Haven specials.

Another possible strategy was with Master of Ice to strategically slow down a unit with a turn coming up, and as much as possible keep a monopoly on the entire initiative bar. Since I'd be using the freeze side effect, Spell Power would not be too much of an issue.

(6) Honestly can't see why I would pick Fallen Knight as the Morale penalty seems too painful. So much for Haven is dependent on Morale and the loss of other Mass Dark Magic spells seems a big sacrifice. I figure Mass spells are best if you just pile them on so much the enemy can't Cleanse them (Mass Cleanse is area effect, not all units) and even with Magic Resistance you have a reasonable chance of at least affecting some units.

(7) My Squires almost never see action since they move so short a distance. And when they attack, I rarely commit unless I am guaranteed no significant retaliation (I don't like losing units, and on Heroic versus the AI, I can usually squeak by with very few losses). What's a good strategy? I'm thinking they could either stay put and defend my shooters, or carefully move around and further shield my Cavaliers.

(8) Nice post about Retaliation and Griffins! I was wondering what to do about Godric, and maybe I will build his skills with that strategy in mind. In the worst case, I could field a single godzilla stack of Imperial Griffins and let it go at the enemy. If/When it finally dies, Guardian Angel can take over. Otherwise, I'll Resurrect the stack with Light Magic. And since I'm fielding only one stack, Mass spells aren't necessary.

(9) Not clear about Retaliation Strike in general. Latest version seems to be unlimited duration but for one stack only and only against melee attacks (?). Quest Quest
Edited on Sat, Jul 07 2007, 11:31 by Grail Quest

[Kibester]

My strategy is this: Get hell a lot of peasants and archer. Train peasants to archers and upgrade to marksmen. And turtle the marksmen till the end. Buff with something nice and voila. I had 2000 marksmen in one of my games =) I uhh... kinda won..

[winterfate]

I LOVE that strategy!

But, Training got a cap in 2.1...

So, no more 2K Marksmen for us.

[Ceres]

I'm going to try that! I just don't know how to do that 'turtle' thing you guys are talking about.

[Wraith]

take both luck and leadership skills and get somehow lot of money train units and get artifacts ring of speed and ring of celertity or what that was and cloak of death shadow and luck and morale artifacts then your are allmost invisble (i dont know how it is spelled)

[Grail Quest]

I'm finding that I shouldn't field less than 2 stacks of Archangels against the AI, because a high-level hero will definitely kill one per strike, which means if I only have one stack, there's no one to raise the angel. And if it had been a stack of 1, I've just lost my ability to resurrect, which was the whole point of putting them on the field in the first place. So, I need 2 stacks of at least 2.

That, or have a damage-soak stack that can somehow hold the AI's priority.

[Cleanpea]

Invincible:)

[aaelgr]

I always find that Leadership is essential. Swiftness helps get Paladins across the battlefield in one go. Logistics and War Machines also go well together. Familiar Ground and Death March and you can run rings around most units. Catapulting the Gate out of the way in the first go gets your Paladins right in there, with the Griffins and Angels not far behind.