Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

[Gray Magic Expert]

Wouldn't it be better to negate relic stacking instead, since that's where the overpoweredness is coming from anyway?

No, it would be worse.
Problem is: most Artifacts/Relics are rather meh compared to normal high-level items. The fact that relic bonuses can stack, unlike normal enchantments, makes relics cool.

Without stacking, too many relics would become almost pointless from gameplay perspective. And this devalues the immersion too: when description says that the Item is famous, powerful and ancient, but the item itself is worse then a boring Duelist Longsword of the Vampire - then description feels like a joke, and the world feels more flat.

As for the balance issue:
To reach a really overpowered stage, a player needs to have a really fat stack of proper relics.
Finding all the needed relics by accident requires luck.
Finding all the needed relics by reloading is insanely time-consuming. If a power-gamer wants to do this - power to them, I'd say.

So, unless we are talking about serious late game (clearing 2 continets worth of High-level locations), there is definitely no problem with overpowered-ness. And if we are talking about serious late game - then what's the problem?
Being really OP in the lategame is arguably the part of the whole deal. This was the case in vanilla Might and Magic 6, 7, 8. It arguably was the case even in Chaos Conspiracy lategame (Land-That-Time-Forgot; Pyramid 2). So I don't see a problem here.

[Xfing]

If I am not mistaken, Spiritslayer description says only:
"Many under the rule of Luthiner the Severe saw the existence of his spear Spiritslayer as proof of the existence of evil. The injuries caused by the spear go beyond the physical as Spiritslayer takes a strike as an opportunity to drink its target's very essence."
Does this really imply anything beyond Master Spirit Magic "Spirit Lash" spell?

It's not the effects of the enchantment that should matter, so no idea where you took the Spirit Lash think from and why do you think it's relevant. The description of the spear says that people "saw the existence of his spear Spiritslayer as proof of the existence of evil". You say it's "only" that? I don't know what possible description could drive the point home harder than this one that the spear is evil. If that's not enough for you, take a gander at what it looks like. And if even that's not enough, the effect its enchantment has is in fact quite malevolent, drinking a target's essence/vampirism is already considered a dark power. So yeah, this is probably the single item that'd be best justified in being restricted to evil characters. Keep in mind that the good/evil restriction was never about physical incapability of wielding some item - it's only about refusal to do so. Artifacts with evil histories disgust kind-hearted characters, and artifacts associated with good make evil characters sick. It's 100% a role-playing thing.

And there is also no Spear-wielding Evil Classes in might and magic 8 - so restricting a MM8 artifact in such a way feels wrong...

Hardly a problem in Merge. You want to wield Spiritslayer, you travel to Enroth and turn your Champion into a Black Knight. Way more fitting.

I think, Hades would make for a better new Evil-Only Item.
Hades originally comes from MM6, and MM6 has easily-accessible dark-light trainers. Also, Hades is described as a vile Relic (arguably, more vile than Spiritslayer). This is the case, where adding an Evil-only requirement will greatly enhance immersion

And yeah, that's what I did too, made Hades an evil-only sword. But again, it's not about gameplay or it being from Enroth. First of all, you can find all continents' artifacts anywhere now, so that's not even relevant. It's just that the sword's description sounded appropriately evil - just like Spiritslayer's did.

unlike
- Old Nick (Just a renoun assassin weapon. Infamous? Definitely! But not more Vile than a wand of Sharpmetal/Paralysis...)

Again, it's not about mechanics, it's about role playing. How the item looks and what it does is not as important here as the flavor text, which says that Old Nick has "killed more people than the plague". Probably referring to innocent assassination marks. So it's understandable that good characters might want nothing to do with a weapon like this.

- Twilight Cloak (Described as a sneaky tool for Assassins and Spies. Spies are a Light class in MM7...)
- Taledon's Helmet (Just a cool hat of a dead Sun Priest. Ghoulsbane or Sun Amulets are not Good Only, despite their coonection to Sun Temple)

Yeah, these items don't feel all that justified maybe, but that's what we were given. I like to think the items I thought about adding were considered more carefully. But still, I'd be happy if what makes it into the main branch is just fixing the MM7 items, making Spiritslayer evil and Eclipse only for Sun Priests. The rest of what I made is just a showcase of what can be done with the lua script in this matter. I still like having many artifacts with alignment restrictions, and also like the wider categories of "not good" and "not evil", which exclude less classes than they include.

By penalizing evil clerics and banning them from Igraine, you will only punish quirky builds.
True min-maxers will simply make a one Dark specialist and one Self specialist.

Igraine was one of the artifacts I felt the least strong about in fact, I only made it "not evil" because the flavor text said it was made by Enrothian clerics - who are considered good. But that's probably not conclusive evidence, I wouldn't mind this one being reverted to neutral one bit. And I do see your point, dark clerics should have access to one artifact that boosts all self schools, otherwise there's even less point in making them than there is now (liches are still superior due to their range of available dark magic boosters).

And this is true for many of the suggested restrictions.
- Elsenrail/Glomenthal do not work on knights? A really cool-looking setup is disabled. But min-maxer would use Vampiric Weapons and/or Terminus/Wallace anyways for most of the fights!
- Harek's Leather is now not Good? Well, my Archmage lost a really kickass piece of fashion! Back to old, boring and reliable Alvarian Leather
of Earth/Serndine's Protection options. They are more powerful items anyways...
This is what I mean by "Boring". Removing funny options does not make the game deeper!

I really fail to see your point here. Some players wanted "funny" and I think in the community branch you could even have Minotaurs wear headwear. Helmets with holes made for their horns and all that. Isn't that "funny"? Sure as hell is. But it's not very realistic.

As for Elsenrail and Glomenthal, my reasoning was that good characters might be repulsed by the element of darkness and vice versa, while neutrals such as dark elves wouldn't mind either. But I guess that might be a little bit of a reach, since the swords themselves are meant to represent balance, not good or evil. While that still supports my point that neutral classes should have the biggest affinity for both, I don't feel all that strongly about them being restricted. Hareck's leather, on the other hand, was made "not good" simply because Hareck was a prick. But that in and of itself might not be a deal-breaker for good characters either. So yeah, I don't insist on this one either. My proposals were just ideas, it just takes a few small edits in the text files to roll them back.

Same is true for many Race restrictions. Penalizing armmaster on elves, for example, would make them pathetic knights. They are unoptimal, but funny and playable knights right now. But they will become unplayable without GM armmaster. Same goes for, say, penalizing maces on elven paladins. Or penalizing Bows on dwarven Archers. Or penalizing magic skills on goblins.
Skill penalties may reduce class variety instead of improving it!

Well that depends - from a mechanical perspective races don't really make a difference in the long run, especially in the late game. Giving them boosts to skills has already largely addressed that issue, it's just that having some penalty would let us make the boosts more significant, but in such a way that it remains fair. If dwarves had a penalty to the bow skill but you really, really want to make that dwarf archer, you're just being picky. Most RPG games of that era had restrictions to races that made only certain race-class combos viable.

Currently there are no plans to implement pentalties to skills based on race, but if there were - maybe a good compromise would be avoiding magic and weapon-based skills and sticking to miscellaneous ones and possibly armor. Like, Goblins could take a penalty to Merchant (not naturally known to be very charming), but get something really cool like +Armsmaster in exchange. Magic boosts to single magic schools would be pretty cool (f.ex. Dwarves and earth magic or something along these lines), but it'd have to be considered carefully.

But even if you don't like the idea of skill penalties of any kind, I think what we at least could consider is guaranteeing different skillcaps for branched good/evil promotions, much in the vein of Master/Ninja in MM7. Masters get expert level self magic while Ninjas get master disarm - both of which are meaningful advantages. It might not always be easy to come up with proper differences, but for example Ranger Lords could get better Alchemy and Merchant while Bounty Hunters get better Stealing/Disarm or something. Of course when changing alignment at Enroth light/dark teachers, whatever extra skillcap the current class has would have to be rolled back when they change paths, to prevent abusing the path change mechanic (so for example expert alchemy ranger lord returns to basic alchemy when switching to bounty hunter).

Oh, and if we went further with these good/evil artifact restrictions and you really find them that bothersome, there might be a solution: make all Enroth-based promotions "neutral". There's unfortunately no room at the moment to do so with the 3 extra classes that joined in mm7, but that would still let you have a fully promoted knight that can wield Elsenrail/Glomenthal at least. Or any combo of "not good" and "not evil" artifacts that may ever be introduced in the future. So for instance:

Cavalier -> Knight Errant/Mercenary Knight
Crusader -> Zealot/Fanatic (gets neither basic dark or light magic but some other improved skill caps in return)
Battle Mage -> Warrior Mage (restore MM6's progression for naming these classes, behaves the same as Zealot in terms of skillcaps)
Great Druid -> Augur/Shaman/Occultist/Hierophant (take your pick)

And just for the lulz, while impossible, here would be my ideas for the remaining classes' neutral promo names:
Hunter -> Wanderer/Vagabond/Adventurer
Initiate -> Pugilist/Martial Artist
Rogue -> Master Thief/Catburglar/Marauder

These last 3 would require coding in extra quests for them, which is somewhat difficult - but even with only the 6 Enroth-based classes having neutral versions, a lot of restricted artifacts could open up for use.

[Gray Magic Expert]

It's not the effects of the enchantment that should matter, so no idea where you took the Spirit Lash think from and why do you think it's relevant. The description of the spear says that people "saw the existence of his spear Spiritslayer as proof of the existence of evil". You say it's "only" that? I don't know what possible description could drive the point home harder than this one that the spear is evil. If that's not enough for you, take a gander at what it looks like. And if even that's not enough, the effect its enchantment has is in fact quite malevolent, drinking a target's essence/vampirism is already considered a dark power.

1) Some people in Might and Magic world see Baa Temple as good guys, who are all about helping the poor.
Dyson Leland saw Temple of the Sun and Neromacer's Guild as equally bad organisations - which is ridiculous. (Don't get me wrong, I am all for friendly necromancers and I don't like greedy religious zealots. Still, necromancers in MM8 commited more sins then the Murmurwoods Temple of the Sun - this is a fact)
"People saw Spiritslayer as Really EVIL" is not a proof of the spear being more evil than other artifacts.
2) As for the looks - Justice Mace, a might and magic 7 artifact of Good also has lots of spikes and even a skull with glowing red eyes. Yet it is opposite from Evil! Or a bucket of Gold Paint is enough to make any evil-looking item into an Artifact of Good?
3) Good characters use vampiric artifacts all the time. Hell, a Vampiric Villian's blade is a reward for completing Light Path paladin promotion in might and magic 7! So life drain by itself is not a dealbreaker.

Keep in mind that the good/evil restriction was never about physical incapability of wielding some item - it's only about refusal to do so. Artifacts with evil histories disgust kind-hearted characters, and artifacts associated with good make evil characters sick. It's 100% a role-playing thing.

I don't think this is true. If this was true - than Light Path characters would refuse to use scrolls like Armageddon or Sacrifice. Yet, they use such scrolls quite happily.
I always interpreted alignment restriction as the property of the item itself. An artifact is so infused with the power of Light/Darkness, that it is physically impossible to properly use without appropriate alignment. It does not make any sense to me that an Archmage or Hero would refuse to pick up an Assasin's dagger Old Nick, yet the same Archmage or Hero would happily read a scroll of Armaggedon in the middle of Steadwick, or Harmondale!

Hardly a problem in Merge. You want to wield Spiritslayer, you travel to Enroth and turn your Champion into a Black Knight. Way more fitting.

That's such an immersion-breaking idea, you know... Greedy bloodthirsty Dragon Hunters are GOOD GUYS. So there is no BAD GUY knights in Jadame. To sidestep this problem, you must jump into a different timeline, and only after talking with a right dude/lady in Enroth, your knight will have a change of heart and turn from Greedy bloodthirsty GOOD GUY into a Greedy bloodthirsty BAD GUY.
This sounds so stupid...

And yeah, that's what I did too, made Hades an evil-only sword. But again, it's not about gameplay or it being from Enroth. First of all, you can find all continents' artifacts anywhere now, so that's not even relevant. It's just that the sword's description sounded appropriately evil - just like Spiritslayer's did.

Its relevant. Spiritslayer is mm8 content. By making in Enroth-related, you tamper with original game of Might and Magic 8. Merge becomes worse at represnting mm8. Hades is a bonus to mm8. So visiting a bonus location for properly unlocking Hades feels fair. Also, vampires would get an access to Hades without leaving Jadame. They cannot use spears, however...
And if you start in MM6, you do not need to jump timelines to unlock Hades - and thus MM6 gameplay/story is left intact.

Again, it's not about mechanics, it's about role playing. How the item looks and what it does is not as important here as the flavor text, which says that Old Nick has "killed more people than the plague". Probably referring to innocent assassination marks. So it's understandable that good characters might want nothing to do with a weapon like this.

The very same good characters, who happily use William Setag's blade and wands of Sharpmetal?
The very same good characters, who paralyze their enemies and then kill those helpless immobilized foes?
Those good charcters suddenly feel repulsed by an assassins' weapon?
And even neutral characters feel the same?
To be completely fair, this sounds silly to me.

Igraine was one of the artifacts I felt the least strong about in fact, I only made it "not evil" because the flavor text said it was made by Enrothian clerics - who are considered good. But that's probably not conclusive evidence, I wouldn't mind this one being reverted to neutral one bit. And I do see your point, dark clerics should have access to one artifact that boosts all self schools, otherwise there's even less point in making them than there is now (liches are still superior due to their range of available dark magic boosters).

Enrothian clerics are happy to learn dark magic and Anthony Stone, their head priest, also presides over semi-official thieves guild... Those guys are not Light Path followers by any means.
Eclipse, of course, looks silly on dark clerics. But maybe it could be worth to make Eclipse into "Non-evil Clerics and All Good Classes" instead of Cleric Only? In might and magic 8, this will change almost nothing, but will give a powerful additional item to paladins, druids and maybe even rangers...

As for Elsenrail and Glomenthal, my reasoning was that good characters might be repulsed by the element of darkness and vice versa, while neutrals such as dark elves wouldn't mind either. But I guess that might be a little bit of a reach, since the swords themselves are meant to represent balance, not good or evil. While that still supports my point that neutral classes should have the biggest affinity for both, I don't feel all that strongly about them being restricted. Hareck's leather, on the other hand, was made "not good" simply because Hareck was a prick. But that in and of itself might not be a deal-breaker for good characters either. So yeah, I don't insist on this one either. My proposals were just ideas, it just takes a few small edits in the text files to roll them back.

I think, in those cases the players themselves should decide, how their characters would react. No need to restrict this in mechanics.
Some Good Guys would be happy to serve Balance. Others would go all in into serving the Light. Some Bad Guys would love to use Light-Magic sword for Dark means. Others will find light magic repulsive in any way, shape or form. So pirate artifacts, like Harek's Leather and Corsair, things like Ruler's Ring, and Swords of Balance should remain unrestricted.

[Orlock]

Please tell me how I can increase the size of the textures so that sprites larger than the original ones are displayed correctly?

[cthscr]

The very same good characters, who paralyze their enemies and then kill those helpless immobilized foes?

Nitpick: paralyzed enemies are ignored as targets in vanilla (just like stoned ones).

[Gray Magic Expert]

Nitpick: paralyzed enemies are ignored as targets in vanilla (just like stoned ones).

I mean that Light Path characters get access to Paralyze spell.
Paralyzing enemies and then killing them is one of the benefits of Light Magic in mm7 and 8.
(In mm 6, monster Status resistance is too high to use Paralysis effectively, but it can also be done)

It feels odd, and maybe even hypocritical to consider Old Nick too Evil to Use because Assassins Are Bad, while still killing helpless victims of any kind.
Paralysis spell, both from Wand and from Light skill is used for exactly that: it makes victims helpless.

From story and lore perspective it would make a bit more sense, If Old Nick was specifically enchanted by Assassin Guild to be Evil Only... Even still, Old Nick is a very strange choice for Evil Only Relic, unlike the Ethric's Staff.

[Rodril]

Please tell me how I can increase the size of the textures so that sprites larger than the original ones are displayed correctly?

I've never done it myself. Check this topic: https://www.celestialheavens.com/forum/10/16963
I am not sure MM8 will support it without drastic fps drop, as there are mentions of special MM7 patch, also I cannot open MM8 .hwl archives with current MMArchive, what seem to be requirment.

[Mortis]

Light and dark items property was only in MM7 because of light and dark path. Merge is mix of three different games, so artifacts from MM7 should remain with such properties, but i don't agree to make other artifacts from for example MM8 to be good or evil. In MM8 there are no typical good or bad sides. Vampire, necromancer and troll which are generally evil characters can ally with Temple of Sun, clerics, in opposite, can choose dark path with necromancer guild. Minotaurs which in MM7 were enemies, in MM8 are good and even choosable characters. Immersion is important, but should always
be connected with freedom of choice. So - no more restrictions!

[Mortis]

Artifacts could be changed in better ways without being restricted. Elsenrail for example could have additionaly "undead slayer" property and that would make it somehow "good" weapon. Glomenthal could have lifestealing property to feel appropriately "evil".
I also think that bonuses from additional damage for artifacts should be unified. Part of them have constant value, for example 30 fire damage with Ares, 20 electric with Artemis and 10- 20 dark/light with Glomenthal/ Elsenrail. Both swords should have constant 20 bonus damage.
The second thing, in MM8 there are two artifacts(Breaker and Guardian) with the same damage bonus- body damage. This isn't good for immersion and also body damage is quite useless against undead and totally uselles against oozes. Should be changed.
For immersion- i dont understand why " chance to avoid any attack" is property of GM unarmed, not of dodge skill. Tomsod changed it in his Elemental mod and repaired this effect, so now monk can avoid literally any attack, not only from arrows. In my opinion this solution should be implemented to merge project.

[justl]

How about a compromise for that Good/Evil discussion:

if its possible to make 2 versions for the items.txt/mmmerge.t.lod/extraartifacts.lua without the loss ofe other features, then put together a package for downloading in the first post of the thread (or better said -> have rodril put the link to the archive there).

this way everyone can play in their own style without getting agitated over good/evil matters...

[Xfing]

How about a compromise for that Good/Evil discussion:

if its possible to make 2 versions for the items.txt/mmmerge.t.lod/extraartifacts.lua without the loss ofe other features, then put together a package for downloading in the first post of the thread (or better said -> have rodril put the link to the archive there).

this way everyone can play in their own style without getting agitated over good/evil matters...

Ok, I'll prepare an alternate package that just restores the mm7 artifacts, but I feel too strongly about Eclipse and Spiritslayer to leave them untouched, so y'all will have to live with these (would have to be really anal to be bothered by these particular choices though, I think). Others who think extra artifacts being restricted helps immersion are welcome to use my previous version.

In general, I think the merge is about blurring the boundaries between the 3 games, not keeping them as separate as possible. There have been many systems and mechanics introduced that bring the games closer together such as the repaints of all apparel, tiering all items (15 or 11 levels), random loot containing items from all 3 games etc. Expanding the "good/evil" item wear requirements beyond just MM7 feels like a logical next step - I'd personally also not mind seeing something like mixing monsters from all 3 games in certain areas - for example Dagger Wound Island could use some dragonflies here and there, that kind of thing. But of course something like this would be a very serious undertaking and require a lot of planning.

Still, for the reason of integration, I'd at least recommend making things like Spiritslayer or Hades mandatorily evil and the Mace of the Sun good for example.

[Xfing]

Ok, here's a "bare minimum version", containing only the following changes:
- Fixed the ones from MM7 so they work as intended
- Blade of Mercy works for Master Necromancers (can't see why it shouldn't)
- Eclipse is exclusive to Priests of the Sun, as was intended in MM8 (only regular clerics were on the light path there by default)

I'm personally staying on the previous version since I think the restrictions add spice, but this one would probably be safer for integration with the main release. I'd still advocate for making at least Spiritslayer and Hades evil in the version that goes to integration, and maybe the Mace of the Sun good. But that can be arranged when Rodril decides on the scope he wants to integrate.

Oh, and if I can have an unrelated suggestion - I think it would be fair that the Master Wizard promotion by Albert Newton in Enroth also affects Necromancers, not just the Wizard class - after all the skills have full overlap and the Master Wizard is an improvement in all aspects over the Necromancer. That'd give an extra avenue for Jadamean Necromancer NPCs to get a non-Lich final promotion - which they could then switch to Master Necromancer at a dark trainer anyhow, if someone would like to roleplay as a character who has kept their flesh and individual portrait. What do you think?

[Gray Magic Expert]

Oh, and if I can have an unrelated suggestion - I think it would be fair that the Master Wizard promotion by Albert Newton in Enroth also affects Necromancers, not just the Wizard class - after all the skills have full overlap and the Master Wizard is an improvement in all aspects over the Necromancer. That'd give an extra avenue for Jadamean Necromancer NPCs to get a non-Lich final promotion - which they could then switch to Master Necromancer at a dark trainer anyhow, if someone would like to roleplay as a character who has kept their flesh and individual portrait. What do you think?

I think that this is a brilliant idea!
Right now, a mm6-7 sorcerer can already become a mm8 necromancer instead of mm6-7 wizard.

So it will make a lot of sense, if mm8 Necromancer would be able to become a mm6-7 Master Wizard/Archmage/Master Necromancer, to make things work both ways.

[Xfing]

Exactly - once a lich, there is no going back, but opening up master wizard for necromancers would open up the whole gamut for them - a master necromancer could even switch to archmage, and having that path available for MM8 necromancer NPCs would be pretty cool.

Speaking of archmages and new artifact ideas - I've noticed that liches in general have a huge advantage over archmages in terms of utility/how good they are (and over master necromancers too, to be honest). They get the extremely powerful Ethric's staff and are unaffected by the life leech, they get the Crown of Final Dominion, + Last Stage Cuirass which synergizes with their self school immunities - none of which the living mage classes can benefit from. Archmages maybe have an open slot for wielding the Staff of Elements (probably the BIS for them), but otherwise don't have any dedicated light-boosting artifacts available, so the best they can hope for is the light cloak + generic light ring for a 100% bonus. But the cloak usually goes to the Cleric, same with Taledon's Helm. A 100% boost to a school would, of course, under normal circumstances already be tremendously powerful, but we're doing Merge here, right?

So my idea for a relic ring geared towards Archmages, and probably Good-restricted, would be something like this:

Archmage's Intent
Base item: Angel's Ring (top MM7 ring) or Sun Opal Ring from MM7 - in the latter case with the jewel possibly recolored to red or orange
Effect: (of Fire Magic, of Light Magic, Intellect +50, Personality -40, Good)
Description: The creation of such rings is a crowning achievement for master artificers from the Bracadan School of Sorcery, and it can take several years to produce just one. No wonder then that they are only awarded to exceptionally well-deserved Archmages for special merits, and only after years of service. The ring bestows upon the wearer acuity of mind and improved prowess in fire and light magic, though also imbuing them with a sense of sternness and righteous anger at the forces of evil -- which may make them come across as gruff and unapproachable to others.

what do you think? I could come up with more of them haha

[Xfing]

Hey, I've noticed some inconsistencies in Class Skills.txt, so I've made some minor tweaks. Use'em if you like 'em. The major overhauls such as Druids being able to GM all schools have not been touched.


- Liches and the remaining sorcerer classes were inconsistent. Liches had GM Alchemy again for some reason (like in MM8, probably due to the cutting of the Druid class), while non-Liches had access to expert Repair Item. I've removed Repair Item for all the classes and GM alchemy for Liches (they can once again only have Master level). Master Necromancers also had GM in Meditation, brought it down to Master. Now all the classes are consistent at all stages, except how Liches can get Regeneration. Disarm Trap was accessible at basic level only to the highest promoted classes, changed it to be learnable at all promotion levels.

- Restored GM Axe for Minotaur Lords. The table says they're capped at Master, but characters of the Minotaur race and class created in the character creation screen will still be treated as receiving the racial bonus, so you'll get GM Axe regardless. Only the pre-made MM8 NPCs didn't get it, one of whom comes with Axe Grand anyhow. Also, Minos are known for using axes so it's not like Rangers need to have this one over the Minos - these guys have already gotten a decent buff with Master Armsmaster.

- Gave Clerics Expert in Staff like in MM8, rather than basic like in MM7. I thought that was a good idea and definitely helps Clerics make up for some of that gargantuan boost to armor class they discard by not carrying a shield. Also, Clerics and Priests didn't have access to Armsmaster for some reason, gained it only at their final promotion. I don't think that was very fair or needed, so I made the skill available to the base classes as well.

- Gave the Archer class master in Meditation. Why? Because they're the opposite to Paladins, who get master to Bodybuilding only. So it's fair the Archer has the opposite benefit. This is nice for that symmetry they've got going. Also, that'll make the Archer class just a little bit more competitive with the Dark Elf.

- Gave Vampires expert Meditation to match the Dark Elves. Frankly, it's weird that a hybrid caster class with up to mastery in self schools didn't have any level of this skill available, while even Rangers had access to basic. Also gave them up to Expert in Unarmed - they're portrayed in both MM7 and MM8 as using their bare clawed hands for attacking when they're hostile monsters, so even though you won't be using this skill much, it's good for the fantasy of being able to build a vampire capable of threatening barehanded strikes.

- Gave Bounty Hunters/Ranger Lords expert alchemy, requiring promotion. Being that they're advertised as a "knight/druid hybrid" and Druids being the only class to GM the skill, this feels only fair. Also, Dark Elves are still probably the best class in the game in terms of their misc skill repertoire, this will help Rangers compete just a little bit.

In RaceSkills I've also made very minor tweaks:
- Vamps no longer get pluses to Perception (why would they?), instead they get E/0/W to Regeneration. I think that was intended originally, because these skills are next to each other in the table. E/1/0 to Perception goes to Minos and Dragons, who had GM in these in the game, probably due to their naturally large eyes.

- Dragons no longer get pluses to ID Monster, since they were not GM in that class in the first place. This should be compensated by the above Perception buff.

- Trolls now get E/1/0 to Bodybuilding, which they're known for in addition to regeneration.


Oh, another thing I've noticed is that once I've promoted my Mino necromancer to a lich, he can no longer get Expert in Plate - in fact even the basic skill displays in red. Guaranteed Expert Plate comes with the Mino race - guess they lose the Mino race once they become Liches and that's the reason? Well in this particular case I think the bonus should be preserved or recalculated somehow, since if a player neglected to get expert in plate before the lich transformation, they're SOL. Something to think about for sure. Same of course goes for Axe.

[PicturesOfLily]

Hi, this is an amazing mod and thank you all for working and updating it. I haven't convinced my friends to play this with me...yet. Is there any plans to have voice chat ingame? Or perhaps there is already voicechat. I mean, like you can talk with people only when you are near them? Not only in the same region, but in the proximity of your co-players...and the voices fading when you get away from them?

[Rozwaal]

Ok, here's a "bare minimum version", containing only the following changes:
- Fixed the ones from MM7 so they work as intended
- Blade of Mercy works for Master Necromancers (can't see why it shouldn't)
- Eclipse is exclusive to Priests of the Sun, as was intended in MM8 (only regular clerics were on the light path there by default)

I'm personally staying on the previous version since I think the restrictions add spice, but this one would probably be safer for integration with the main release. I'd still advocate for making at least Spiritslayer and Hades evil in the version that goes to integration, and maybe the Mace of the Sun good. But that can be arranged when Rodril decides on the scope he wants to integrate.

Oh, and if I can have an unrelated suggestion - I think it would be fair that the Master Wizard promotion by Albert Newton in Enroth also affects Necromancers, not just the Wizard class - after all the skills have full overlap and the Master Wizard is an improvement in all aspects over the Necromancer. That'd give an extra avenue for Jadamean Necromancer NPCs to get a non-Lich final promotion - which they could then switch to Master Necromancer at a dark trainer anyhow, if someone would like to roleplay as a character who has kept their flesh and individual portrait. What do you think?

Why do you just want to limit something? What is the point of limiting the player in his worldview and giving clear instructions on what is “good” and what is “bad”? It was only after so long that we came to the idea of complete freedom in class and race, and you want to roll back everything and again reduce everything to a template and post a huge table "LOCKED" on all possible combinations

[Arch-vile]

There are new ideas, but there are still major bugs in Merge

[candida]

Hi there (after a long hiatus),

Just started testing the last update, one small question:

Is it possible to go to Emerald Island back after completing the contest by ship?

Just not to be mistaken, especially if you don't start in Antagarich, but in other continents?

[Xfing]

Why do you just want to limit something? What is the point of limiting the player in his worldview and giving clear instructions on what is “good” and what is “bad”? It was only after so long that we came to the idea of complete freedom in class and race, and you want to roll back everything and again reduce everything to a template and post a huge table "LOCKED" on all possible combinations

Having "dragon knights" and the like is still not the standard way to play. It's a possibility for niche players and a quirky experiment at best, and clearly breaks immersion. That's like allowing the player to pick the Barbarian's model in Diablo 2 but have him develop according to the Necromancer's skill tree, for example. Because why limit something, right?